Thursday, December 31, 2009

Malaysia's Allah

Catholic's Allah, Islam's Allah. And so Justice Lau Bee Lan of the KL High Court ruled today that it was illegal for the Home Ministry to prohibit the Catholic Herald from using the word Allah. See story below.

SatD, in Demi Allah, demanded why the sitting judge was a non-Muslim. Like him, I'm taken aback by the judgment. But if the sitting judge had been a Muslim and he had ruled the same, it would have been worse.

To bro SatD and others like him, let's wait for the Appeals Court.

In the meantime, if the rest of you feel like celebrating ... Happy New Year. I'm suddenly feeling a little under the weather ...

General December 31, 2009 17:15 PM
Catholic Magazine Herald Can Use Word "Allah"


KUALA LUMPUR, Dec 31 (Bernama) -- The Catholic weekly magazine, Herald, can use the word "Allah" in its publications, the High Court here ruled on Thursday.

Justice Datuk Lau Bee Lan, in her oral decision, held that the Herald had the constitutional right to use the word in the magazine to propagate the Christian religion but not Islam.

She said that pursuant to Article 11(4) of the Federal Constitution, it was an offence for non-Muslims to use the word "Allah" to Muslims to propagate the religion.

But it was not an offence for non-Muslims to use the word to the non-Muslims for the purpose of religion, she added.

Pursuant to Articles 11 and 12 of the Federal Constitution, the Herald had the constitutional right to use the word in respect of instruction and education of the congregation in the Christian religion.

Article 10 allowed it to use the word in the exercise of its right to freedom of speech and expression, she said.

Lau said the decision by the Home Minister prohibiting Herald publications from using the word "Allah" in the magazine was illegal, null and void.

She said the minister had also failed to adduce evidence that the use of word would threaten national security and create misunderstanding and confusion among Muslims.

On Feb 16, Archbishop Tan Sri Murphy Pakiam filed for a judicial review on the usage of the word "Allah" in the church's publications, naming the Home Ministry and the government as respondents.

He claimed that the word 'Allah' was not exclusive to the religion of Islam.

On Jan 7, the Home Minister approved the Herald's publishing permit for the period Jan 1 to Dec 31, 2009, on condition that the word "Allah" was not used in it and the words "Restricted" must be printed on the weekly's front page whereby it could only be circulated to Christians and at churches only.

The Home Minister had justified the ban on grounds of national security and to avoid misunderstanding and confusion among Muslims.

-- BERNAMA

165 comments:

CHI8 said...

YOU BLOODY RACIST

Anonymous said...

Kurang ajar! beginilah jadinya kalau terlalu diberi kebebasan.

Anonymous said...

mana leer hero-hero islam yang nak membela ni. passal gaduh sama sendiri terer pulak.. tak berenti-renti keluar kat suratkhabar.. tulis kat dalam blogspot berbulan-bulan tak habis cerita benda yang sama.. ni.. dah samapi masanya menikus pulak.. heran aku..

-ntah-

assalamualaikum said...

Nak masuk Islam wajib mengucap dua kalimah syahadah " LAAILAAHAILLALLAH, MUHAMMADARRASULULLAH "
Bahasa Arab sudah jelas 'Rab' atau 'ila' diterjemahkan kepada Bahasa Melayu bermaksud TUHAN .ALLAH nama Tuhan daripada 99 nama yang disebut dalam Al-Quran bagi umat Islam.
Agama Kristian tidak ada NAMA TUHAN hanya disebut GOD atau LORD sahaja.

Penyalahgunaan dan penyelewengan terjemahan telah lama berlaku di Indonesia dengan menyamakan ALLAH dengan TUHAN.Sebenarnya ALLAH 'NAMA' Tuhan.Ini disengajakan kerana umat bukan Islam berpendapat bahawa Tuhan adalah sama bagi yang beragama di dunia ini mengikut tafsiran mereka, tetapi umat Islam mentafsirkan Tuhan mereka dengan mengikut Al-Quran dan Sunnah.Allah nama Tuhan bagi umat Islam. Tiada Tuhan melainkan Allah.Tuhan yang Esa ( satu )

Anonymous said...

The arrogance and the audacity of the Deputy Public Prosecutor Kamaruddin Mohd Said to infer that the decision handed down by the High Court may only apply to year 2009's permit. Should the permit issued for the year 2010 contain the same prohibition, it may require a new round of legal case. This clearly tells us to what extend they would go to stop this.
Habib RAK

hamba Allah said...

http://paneh.blogspot.com/2009/12/raja-raja-melayu-perlu-bertindak.html

Anonymous said...

The issue is elementary but due to the fact that there has been so much twisting and turning by the kaffirun in tandem with turban Muslim munafuckings coconutheads, the true origins of the term has been obfuscated.

In the Quran, it is clearly stated that Ibrahim, Musa, Isa like Muhammad (PBUH & HF) were Moslems and logically the name of the Almighty to these ancestors of Muhammad would have been Allah unless the Almighty wanted to confute the issue and gave Himself different names to the prophetic lineage for the fun of it. The Quran is not only a religio-spiritual document, it is also socio-historical tract about the origins and genesis of monotheism. There is a teleological continuity between the three Abrahamaic faiths in the form of the personalities involved, the only disjunct being in the conceptualisation of monotheism/tawhid itself. That the priesthood of both Judaism and Christianity twisted Early Islam to generate the heresies namely Judaism and subsequently Christianity is the result of this divergenc from true faith (addeen). This blogsphere does not afford me the oppurtunity to delve into the specifics but there are tomes of evidence to back my assertion. In short, the prevalence of the term Allah predating Muhammad is nothing to be surprised about. It predates him precisely because that was the same term used by Ibrahim, Musa, Isa to address the Almighty and being Muslims themselves, it goes without saying that Allah is essentially an Islam specific term for the Almighty and NEVER a generic construct.

Proof of my contention is elementary, why do the Jews and by extension the Christians use the terms Yahweh/Jehovah, Elohim etc in their holy books. Why not Allah if it is a generic construct that can be interchangeably utilised? The Jews and Christians know for a fact that Allah is an Islamic term and the need to demarcate/differentiate their respective heresies compelled them to generate the Yahwehs, Jehovahs of yore lest they be laughed at by the adherents of pre-Muhammad Islam as purveyors of Satanic cults.
so why the kerfluffle in Malaysia over its usage when the generic and value-neutral tuhan would suffice. Simply for the following reasons:

1 to confute the local Muslim polity that Allah of Christianity and Islam are the same and by extension share the same attributional elements: father/son/ho ghost rubbish

ii. another attempt to demean the belief system of the majority community and cast puerile aspersions as to the validity of the system itself.

iii.yet another attempt to push the one god many pathways agenda, a pathtically laughable idea in itself for it implies existential chaos.

there is only ONE true religion,Islam.The rest, nothing more than superstitious perversions of monotheism i.e., cults. e sooner the kaffirs uderstand and accept that the better but then again the upcoming decade would make that patently clear whether the infidels like it or no for Allah's plan would surely come to pass...sooner than later but then again I am admittedly not a turbaned lollipop clairvoyant out to divine exactly when for I aint gonna fornicate my religion for personal fame or worldly glory as a certain Nikki is grandiously wont to do.

Warrior 231

P/S: Take care bru for I too am a bit down as life seems to be getting crappier by the minute

Anonymous said...

I hope the Home Ministry will appeal; I could not understand the rational of that decision..

Even though I am a Muslim, I have read the bible and I could not found any verse in the whether written in Aramic, Hebrew or Greek) that I found any verse that referred to Allah as equal to God.

The most close verse was in Aramic "Eli Eli Lama Sabachtani"; My Lord My Lord, why has thou forsaken me"

In the old testament the close word to Allah is elohim and Jews for centuries called their G_D as four letters YHWH pronounced as Ye He We He similar to Arabic as Ya Ha Wau Ha. Jehovah witness changed YHWH to JHVH and they call their GOD as Jehovah.

Anonymous said...

Bro Rocky,
Assalam Mu'alaikum,
In Islam Allah is One and Only God and must NOT and SIMPLY CANNOT be associated with any other being or anything at all.
Non Muslims particulalrly Christians, in Indonesia and in Muslim countries in the Middle East -Egypt, Jordan, Syria, Turkey, Algeria etc has been using the word Allah when refering to God but associate their Allah to Jesus or as the Father. In Indonesia for instance whenever Allah is mentioned by the Christian in their sermons,it is mentioned as follows "Allah Yesus (Jesus). Apparently to clearly differentiate the God acknowledged in Islam and their God.
Over hear we say Allah Subhanu Wata'alla (SWT) - Allah the Almighty and cannot and must not be associated with anything else.
With due respect the learned Judge apparently is ignorant of this very glaring differences which are significant. Allah the Father and Allah Jesus can never be the one and the same as Allah SWT.
But if non Muslims were to use the word "Allah SWT - the Father etc" then it can become very provocative and demeaning to Allah Himself - na'uzubillah!
So says Dzulman, Shah Alam

People's Potato said...

As a Malay Muslim, I'm just not too emotional about this issue. The far right Islamist are saying it is wrong, while the liberal islamist are saying it's fine as it does not contradict with the Koran nor the Constitution.

So, where are we heading to Malaysians? I guess not everyone can share the same opinion in this case.

tolokminda said...

I think the ultimate importance is for us to glorify God in a righteous way. God says, serve Him and Him alone, who ever you are. But religious people may they be Muslims, Christians, Hindus, Buddhists or whatever, prone to associate God with so many mortals, relics, towns, etc. And now they quarrel just for the sake of calling God in Arabic. Hypocrites!

Anonymous said...

Will you be happy and satisfied when there is another slaughter in red on our roads or will you stop now, Maybe you have no conscience.

I pity you and wonder how the hell are you going to explain this on Kyamat day

Have some dignity at least

Anonymous said...

THere you go again, blaming race this and race that, just use your brains for once. Any other judgement would be an absurd judgement. You cannot patent a word or sound? Just like televisyen used to be called peti gambar, the English cannot claim the word and who can or can't use it.

If you say that Muslims in Malaysia only can use the Allah word, what about non Muslims from other nations? If you believe that the term Allah refers to the same Supreme Being of Jews, Christians and Muslims, then it should be welcomed that all who believe can use it.

For those who say that some Muslims may be easily confused if they happen to pick up a copy of Herald to read it..hey..firstly, why get confused if its referring to the same God, secondly, if they are SO easly, confused then, the Ulamas must unconfuse them. Right?


Isn't it more confusing that Muslims and killing Muslims due to sectarian violence in Iraq? (just like Christians killing Christians) when they beileve in the same Allah?

When Muslims say " Thank God its ..." Why don't Non-Muslims get annoyed? SHould they not say, "Thank Allah its..."

Please Rocky, grow up lah.. and have a beer on me..tonight. Have a truly Happy New Year, chill out.

Manatau

Anonymous said...

I'm not an expert on hukum...but juz one word for this....INFILTRATION.

Wake up Muslims!!

Duan said...

Well, i dont know about you guys but I am confident that my faith in Islam and Prophet Mohammad PBUH is too strong to be swayed by anything as petty as this. My jihad is a battle within to make myself a better Muslim. Personally, I couldnt care less about how other people choose to call their God.

Anonymous said...

Bro I did not know this : ' that pursuant to Article 11(4) of the Federal Constitution, it was an offence for non-Muslims to use the word "Allah" to Muslims to propagate the religion'. The Law is so clear. The question now is whether using the word Allah in a publication that is available to the public is NOT considered as propagation. I think the Judge has erred. A newspaper including the Catholic Herald is certainly meant to reach everyone including Muslims. Hence 11(4) would apply. I am not pertrubed by who uses Allah but the Law is so clear. From a public interest point of view the judgement is not well thought at all. I can understand your feeling under the weather. This stirs up a lot of crap, and for what? May I suggest the word Tuhan. It is a beautiful word. Syed Akbar Ali

Azhar Abdullah said...

Luke 1:35: "The angel answered and said to her, 'The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; and for that reason the holy Child shall be called the Son of God.'"

Terjemahan mengikut keputusan Mahkamah Tinggi hari ini :

"Malaikat itu menjawab dan menyatakan kepadanya, 'Roh yang suci akan datang kepada kamu, dan kuasa yang paling tinggi akan mengatasi kamu; dan untuk sebab itu anak yang suci akan digelar Anak Allah.'"

Read the rest at my blog...

Anonymous said...

CH18...YOU BLOODY STUPID

IT'S NOT ABOUT RACE HERE

IT'S ABOUT RELIGION !!

disgusted :(

malaymind said...

Why should some people keep on trying to confuse people when there's no need for that? Or do Christians do need the word Allah desperately in order to be seeing as the same level as Islam?

The fact is Muslim's Allah do not have son when others' Allah do. If that SUCH BIG DIFFERENCE is still not consider as a DIFFERENT, I'm not sure what is.

Yes, peti gambar or television is a general word which ANYBODY CAN USE, but Television SONY is copyrighted only to SONY's. God is general in English, but Allah is also a GOD WITH NO CHILD for Muslim in Malaysia especially, which should not be regarded as the same as others' Allah.

I hope you have better things to do than keep on fighting to use muslims' term. On the other hand, we Muslim have no desire to change 'church' for our 'mosque', or 'pray' for our 'solat'.

We have better thing to do than trying to confuse other people.

Anonymous said...

http://www.islamreligion.com/articles/195/

Who is Allah by Abdurrahman Robert Squires

Jeffry said...

Duan said...
Well, i dont know about you guys but I am confident that my faith in Islam and Prophet Mohammad PBUH is too strong to be swayed by anything as petty as this. My jihad is a battle within to make myself a better Muslim. Personally, I couldnt care less about how other people choose to call their God.


WAIT TIL UR GRANDSON OR YOUR CICIT OR WHATEVER LEARN IF ONE DAY WHEN AKIDAH REALLY PLAY THEIR PART KEHKEHKEH

dHarjma said...

i write jesus christ all the time! (but im sikh). wait maybe its kurang ajar...

Anonymous said...

Do Christians and Muslims Worship the Same God? Part Five

by Umar F. Abd-Allah

As a Muslim, I am led by my understanding of religious history, languages and Islamic theology to say unequivocally that Christians and Muslims worship the same God. But at the outset I wonder if it is appropriate to ignore the political setting for discussing such a topic and its possible bearing on human lives. The quotations from George Bush and Ted Haggard -- the first timely, the second reckless -- give the appearance of offering theological clarifications, while each is firmly grounded in political bedrock.

We must first be clear about what we mean when we ask if Christians and Muslims worship the same God. Is it a question of indication and identity or of attributions, character and actions? Are we talking about subjects or predicates? Ultimately, we must talk about both. By focusing on the subject -- the ontological identity of the object we worship and the names we use to set it apart -- we enter into an area of common understanding and broad consensus.

Etymologically, Jews, Christians and Muslims originally called God by virtually identical names. The Arabic Allah comes from the same root as the biblical "God" (El hîm h_-El_hîm and h_-Elôh) invoked by the Hebrew prophets or the Aramaic/Syriac Al_h presumably used by John the Baptist and Jesus. Historically, we have identified our "object of worship" -- probably the literal proto-Semitic sense of All--h, El_hîm and Al_h_ -- as the God of Abraham. And, in general, homo religiosus -- within and without the Abrahamic traditions -- makes remarkably similar allusions to God, creator of the heavens and earth.

From a Muslim’s perspective, the premise that Muslims, Jews and Christians believe in the same God -- the God of Abraham -- is so central to Islamic theology that unqualified rejection of it would, for many, be tantamount to a repudiation of faith. From the Qur’anic standpoint, Muslims, Christians and Jews should have no difficulty agreeing that they all turn to the God of Abraham, despite their theological and ritual differences. Historical arguments between their faiths have rarely if ever been over what to call Abraham’s God or who was invoked by that call, and Islamic salvation history is rooted in the conviction that there is a lasting continuity between the dispensations of Muhammad, Abraham, Moses, Jesus and the biblical and extrabiblical prophets.

The Qur’an instructs Muslims to acknowledge openly and forthrightly that their God and the God of biblical religion is the same: "Do not dispute with the people of the Book [the Bible -- Jews and Christians] but in the best of manners, excepting those of them who commit oppression, and say [to them]; ‘We believe in what was revealed to us and what was revealed to you. Our God and your God is one, and we are a people in [willing] submission to him" (Qur’an 29:46).

Bertrand Russell wrote, "The opinions that are held with passion are always those for which no good ground exists." Many of the grounds enflaming passions today between Muslims and non-Muslims have no good ground. If Judaism and Islam are concentric, Christianity and Islam have never been radically far apart. Not infrequently, they have been "too close for comfort" -- geographically and theologically -- although historically this was truer for Catholics than Protestants, to whom the Ottoman Empire gave active backing during the Reformation.

Umar F. Abd-Allah is chairman and scholar in residence at the Nawawi Foundation, a nonprofit educational organization based in Chicago. This article appeared in The Christian Century, August 24, 2004, pp. 34-36. Copyright by the Christian Century Foundation

Love All, Serve All

satD said...

bro try explaining to your kids...

Ada Allah Islam and ada Allah kafir

Happy New Year.... :(

Remember1511 said...

No wonder the christian's themeself condemned by the prophet isa a.s himself.....

-------------------------------------
Jesus said: "Not everyone who says to Me,'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter. Many will say to Me on that day,'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?' "And then I will declare to them,'I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'[Matt. 7:21-23].

-----------------------------------

NoMalayApologist said...

Ini perkara remeh...jika ada golongan yang nak memanggil Tuhan mereka Allah, apa yang kita boleh buat...kalau haramkan, dalam hati dia dia masih akan sebut Allah. Beginilah...kalau Kristian mengharamkan penggunaan 'God' oleh orang Muslim yang berbahasa Inggeris, adakah orang Islam akan marah?

Anonymous said...

Well Rocky.
One must first understand what is the root behind the term "Allah". It is derived fro a Semitic. "Allah" refers to a single entity god. Judaism on which Christianity is based upon use the term Elohim to refer to God, as its a triunion nature of God The Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit.

So for the Catholic Church to use Allah is wrong. It should distinguish that in Christianity, you can only worship God the Father, if you accept Jesus as His Son and the Holy Spirit is in you. This concept is important because nobody can go to the Father except through the Son. It is clearly written in the Bible.

I hope the court of Appeal overturns this decision and the Catholic church uses the term Elohim as what is written in the Bible.

Abdi Allah said...

Can our Arab scholars verify that the word Allah is a generic term for God, i.e. the Arab Christians, etc. call God Allah, too? If that were to be the case, then we should rest our case.

eddy said...

1.I am a Muslim and I call my one and only Tuhan yang Maha Esa, ALLAH. Personally I do not give a hoot whatever other people call their God. What is important kita buat apa yang disuruh dan menjauhi perbuatan yang dilarang nya.

2. Personally I think the Malaysian Civil Court which is based on the British(read western secular) Judicial system may not be the best and fair avenue to decide on matters between religions. What more to decide to use the word Allah which Muslims clearly and unequivocally calls their one and only God, while on the other hand we have the Catholics which refers to the Trinity concept of the Father, the son and the Holy Spirit(The Christian doctrine of the Trinity teaches the unity of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit as three persons in one Godhead-wikipedia). I am actually quite confused here.. so based on the high court ruling which one shall the Christian Herald or the learned Judge refer to as Allah.

3. Could the Majlis Fatwa Kebangsaan enlighthen the Muslims in Malaysia on the implication of this latest judgement by the High Court. Things can get really confused maybe violent when political elements with their own political agenda starts to interpret and convolute what is a religious matter into a political issue. So Majlis Fatwa needed to brief the Majlis Raja-Raja Melayu and Malaysian Muslims and the general public on the matter at hand as soon as possible.

4. Syed Akbar Ali(11:13pm) brought up a good point though when he said, "that pursuant to Article 11(4) of the Federal Constitution, it was an offence for non-Muslims to use the word "Allah" to Muslims to propagate the religion'. The Law is so clear. The question now is whether using the word Allah in a publication that is available to the public is NOT considered as propagation. I think the Judge has erred. A newspaper including the Catholic Herald is certainly meant to reach everyone including Muslims. Hence 11(4) would apply. I am not perturbed by who uses Allah but the Law is so clear. From a public interest point of view the judgement is not well thought at all" end quote.

Looks like the matter is not over yet as round two at the Court of Appeal and then probably round three at the Federal Court looms in the horizon. So do not worry too much Bros it ain't over until its really over or until the Malay rulers intervene, maybe.

Allah hu Akbar, God is Great.

Anonymous said...

Listen here Rocky. Bottomline is, the non Malay non Muslims do not respect the Malays and Islam anymore. They are testing the social contract and the tolerance and the leadership of Malay politicians and Muslim NGOs with the attitude of -"kita mau buat ini macam, kalau berani lawanlah! Kamai tak takut dan tak hormat sama awak".


Padan muka Khalid Samad. Dia sudah ludah agama dia sendiri.

Aku rasa kasi PAS aja bawa isu ni kedepan. Bukankah PAS sanggup mempertahankan agama dan nama Allah hingga ke titisan darah yang terakhir??

Mari kita lihat!

Anonymous said...

This is a sad, sad day for Muslims in Malaysia. They could not stop using their god's name in a Christian paper.

Christians should feel sad too. It's embarrassing for them to use other religion's god's name for their God. Pathetic.

I believe the fight is to 'test' the level of tolerance of Muslims here actually. Now they know Muslims are lembik here. An open door to make more demands.

So, my Muslim friends especially those who are in power, are you just going to sit and watch? Or you need the Muslims to take matters into their own hands?

Sudah Muak

Anonymous said...

aku tunggu komen nik ajiz.

Anonymous said...

a bias decision! just simply dont understand the christian in this country? what ur trying to prove? a freedom of religious? dont u have it in this country?

what say u PAS the so called defender of Islam? why so slow to react?

ularlagibaik@daptonto999years.com

Anonymous said...

What non-sense are u (and other Muslims) thinking?! The Almighty remains Almighty, whatever name u give Him. The word "Allah", spelt A-L-L-A-H, is merely alphabets put together to facilitate earthlings to give Him a name, only in this lifetime in the world.

Why a big fuss about banning people calling YOUR ALLAH, or HIS ALLAH, or HER ALLAH?? Totally ridiculous!

I cant stop laughing at the pathetic narro mindedness of Muslims bros esp in this part of the world! :)

Pure Malaysian

Mazlan said...

I have worked in the Middle East previously and Arab Christians have been using Allah when referring to God in their sermons in Arabic. None of the religious authorities there have questioned it or made it an issue - as one Moroccan friend of mine observed Muslims worship the same God as Christians and that Arab Muslims and Christians have been using the same term many many decades before Islam came to Malaya. And there has been no riots over there over both communities usage of the term.
So why is Malaysia somehow different to them? I suggest next time Malaysians go to the Middle East start criticisng the Arabs for being less holier than us.......see what happens then!

Anonymous said...

Saudara Rocky,

Saya amat-amat tidak faham mengapa ada golongan yang begitu ghairah untuk menggunakan sesuatu yang menjadi 'milik' orang Islam. Apakah tujuannya?

Setahu saya kita umat Islam tidak akan berminat untuk menggunakan istilah-istilah agama lain untuk digunakan dalam agama kita yang suci. Istilah-istilah yang sesuai melambak-lambak untuk digunakan untuk menyampaikan ajaran agama kita tanpa mrnggunakan istilah-istilah agama lain!

Sungguhpun begitu sekiranya kita hendak positifkan perkara ini, saya merasakan ini sebagai satu pengiktirafan tentang kesuciaan dan keagungan agama Islam. Mengapa saya berpendapat begitu?. Ini disebabkan ada golonggan lain yang sanggup bermati-matian hendak menggunakan istilah Islam sehingga sanggup berjuang menpatkannya di- mahkamah dunia.

Rakyat Setia

Anonymous said...

Well said Warrior 231

When the Dutch first translated the bible into the language of the Nusantara (Indonesian) in the 1800's they deliberately chose 'Allah' for God for precisely the same reasons you stated in points i and ii.

The publishers of the Herald don't care about the word 'Allah.' They've not defended the name: when Nike printed 'Allah' in Arabic on their shoes, was there an uproar from the Catholics in Malaysia? Was there a protest from the Catholics when the mainly Christian ISAF in Afghanistan passed out footballs with the word 'Allah' printed on them to be kicked around by Afghan kids? No, not a squeak. It was the Muslims who protested.

Don't be surprised if they start using 'Allah' and 'Isa' in Arabic script in their publications. Packiam and Lawrence just want to confuse Muslims. Devious.

Former Worldly Philosopher

Anonymous said...

aku tak paham banyak2 nama dalam dunia nih kenapa lah Katolik nak berebut nama 'Allah'. Cubalah carik nama lain. Letaklah apa2 nama yang korang suka, McDonald ke, Bush ke ...apa2 je lah. NI tak ..nak jugak nama yang orang Islam punya. Saje je nih .....

Allah-The-Great

The Unspinners said...

Khalid Samad buat khenduri potong kambing Bar B Q malam tadi

Seruan untuk hadhir ramai2 d Masjid Wilayah esok lepas Jumaat 1/1/2010 bagi sama menunjukkan kepekaan saudara terhadap keputusan 'boleh' oleh hakim Low Bi Lian ke atas kes permohonan gereja kristian yg mahu guna kalimah Allah dalam bentuk sebutan dan juga cetakan. Ramai2 nyatakan bantahananda. Sebarkan. Wasalam Allahu Akbar!!!

Spider said...

He he the christians here in Malaysia really want to use Allah as their Jesus?
They got it through the unlearned judge!
Are the christians here so desperate to be muslims? Heard that they want to put up big banners with the word ALLAH on top of their churches.
Good. And the next step is for them to replace their cross to crescent!
And the priest should start wearing turban like Nik Aziz.

So pendakwah islam please go into these churches and start teaching the christians to become muslims.

Ha ha.

Apocryphalist said...

We muslims naturally like that the name Allah be used by all and sundry, no doubt. Especially if it comes from the Christians and Jews who we think derive this faith from the same sources. But listen. They now suddenly want to put the name Allah in their bible with a slight twist:-

(i) For the past 2000 years or so they have NEVER EVER used this name in their bibles, understand? In fact there is a different name to the deity in their bibles all over the world right up to the ones used by the Popes. It is either Eli, Elohim, Jehovah, Yahweh---but NEVER Allah. From this alone Judge Lau Bee Lan’s ruling is questionable.

(ii) Usage of the name Allah is because they need a term to translate the common noun “God” or “Father” in the malay bibles that they have. Problem is: why translate a common noun with a proper noun? Why not just use the proper translation Tuhan? From this Judge Lau Bee Lan’s ruling is puzzling, if not wrong.

(iii) The bibles to which the name Allah appears will be printed for the malay bibles. The bibles in Latin, French, English, Korean, Japanese, Russian, German, Tamil,Swahili, Afrikaaner---all these MUST NOT USE THE NAME ALLAH!! From this Judge Lau Bee Lan’s ruling is highly suspicious.

(iv) And for those who support the Christian issue althought they themselves are not christians but only get in the foray because of the “if it is government let’s go against it”, then they should not have a problem if we start changing out Rukunegara from “Kepercayaan kepada Tuhan” to “Kepercayaan kepada Allah”.

It is clear from this that the intent to vehemently use the name Allah is political in nature and to confuse muslims for greater agendas of CON-version later on.

Now let us hear the fatuosness of some MALAY arguments regarding this issue.

(i) Firstly, the argument of “Why so worked up? My faith for one will not be affected by this ruling”. (See the likes of Potato Head (10:36), TolokMinda (10:44) and Duan 11:05 above). Well sorry to disappoint, if you can’t be bothered, your faith ALREADY IS affected. Because of this nonchalant, lackidaisical attitude, what this means is that you are giving a free hand to missionaries to propagate the obnoxious idea that Allah is not Esa, but only a third of a triumvirate of gods. And remember, it is now legal from now on to propagate these falsehoods to your kids and grandkids in written form. But of course, as one of you said earlier on, you really can’t be bothered with THAT, can you?

(ii) The arguments by people like Dr Manuty, Khalid Samad, Anwar Ibrahim who says something like “…. menggunakan kalimah Allah untuk mengiktiraf dan membesarkan Allah sebagai Tuhan, adalah hak asasi setiap insan.” That may be so, but you didn’t pull in one factor: the fact that this “hak” encompasses extrapolating the usage of the Name to associate blasphemous attributes to this Allah. For example, if some parties would like to name this deity as Allah, it should be allowed, right, with the present ruling above and using the arguments of the afore-mentioned pundits? Why not? Blasphemy is blasphemy, irrespective of whether you paint it in blue or otherwise.

Here you have clear example of how CETEK the thinking capabilities of some of our leaders are. Well I won’t be surprised if it comes from Nik Aziz, Khalid Samad or Anwar Ibrahim whose policies have always been propelled by the dictum “The enemy of my enemy is my friend” and more panci-undi-from-kaffirs kind of thing, but this Manuty fella is one big conundrum. I have replied to the posting in his blog but it never saw the light of day. Fortunately, Mahaguru58 is kind enough to repost my replies here.

Apocryphalist

(To be continued later, but read father Apo’s satire in SaTD …)

Tun Faisal Ismail bin Aziz said...

Tunjukkan solidariti umat Islam anda terhadap keputusan benarkan gereja gunakan nama Allah - sama2 kita ke Masjid Wilayah hari ini utk solat Jumaat dan menyatakan bantahan..http://tunfaisal.blogspot.com/2010/01/bangkit-dan-tentang-keputusan-mahkamah.html

Bagi mereka yang `liberal', sudikan membaca tulisan ini - mungkin sdr bisa membayangkan bagaimana anak-anak kita bakal dikelirukan di masa depan...http://www.buletinpillar.org/index.php?id=20&tx_ttnews%5BpS%5D=1261129268&tx_ttnews%5Btt_news%5D=449&tx_ttnews%5BbackPid%5D=17&cHash=a2ccc1195e

Anonymous said...

from dmh1876

Alhamdullillah,

by this decicision more and more non MUSLIM would recite the word ALLAH and who know by doing so ALLAH would give them HIDAYAH i.e to open their heart to embrace ISLAM as their religion.

So to fellow MUSLIM dont be sad it is a blessing in disguise as to us it is a reminder to us who are busy fighting among each others that we forgot as an UMMAH we should compliment each other for a common aim. This episode is an eye opener as it also reveal who are the real enemy at the gate.

To the non MUSLIM please use the word ALLAH and by doing so ALLAH will show you the rightful path, AMIN.

Duan said...

Jeffry said...

WAIT TIL UR GRANDSON OR YOUR CICIT OR WHATEVER LEARN IF ONE DAY WHEN AKIDAH REALLY PLAY THEIR PART KEHKEHKEH


--------------

Apa yang kau merepek ni Jeffry? Kalau tak erti cakap bahasa inggeris, cakap bahasa malaysia aje kan senang. Buat malu diri sendiri jer la.

Anonymous said...

So the Christians accept Allah as their God.
Now maybe their kids will explore the term Allah and know that the trinity is false and the Truth is there is no god but Allah.
For their bibles has no reference to Allah, and yet Allah is found in the Quran.
InsyaAllah.

Anonymous said...

Aiyah..... Just get the name registered or copy righted. Surely it could come under some intellectual property clause.

Hurry, before the Americans patent it!

A GOOD MAN DOES NOTHING.

Nzain said...

It's so pitiful for Catholic Herald to be so confused with their own religion that they need to take on the word Allah in order to propogate the Christian religion. Seriously, we need to pity them on their lack of faith in their own religion.
There is hope yet. Let's do some reverse psychology. The more they pray to Allah and mention His name in their prayers the easier it will be to change their hearts and convert them to Islam.
So Archbishop Murphy Pakiam, banyak2lah berdoa kepada Allah SubhanAllah semoga terbuka lah hati masing2 untuk bertukar ke jalan Allah.
Amin

Anonymous said...

In Islam

Allah = One and Only God,

then what is

God = ???

Anyone care to define?

Anonymous said...

Apa nak bising pasal hakim tu melayu, cina, india, iban, dayak ke.

Bukankah kita sekarang 1 Malaysia.

Tahniah kepada PM kerana konsep 1 Malaysia ini.

Damansara said...

I never knew that our Catholic friends are unable to actually decide what to call their God!

So what do Protestant Christians etc call their God in Bahasa Malaysia?

'Allah' too?

Aren't all of them are Christians in the first place?

Damansara said...

Bro I have a solution to this.

From today onwards, led by Archibishop Packiam, all Catholics in Malaysia will have a LEARN ONE WORD EVERY DAY session.

They will chant, TUHAN KAMI ADALAH ......(but they have to decide with Christians from all sects first - sebenarnya Tuhan diorang ni apa nama?)

I will personally donate the cost to TATOO THE FOREHEADS of all their Priests with their God's name in Bahasa Malaysia supaya diorang tak lupa sampai bila-bila!

Anonymous said...

this is the start of Malays being discreetly converted thru a programme of confusion, misinformation and bribes

the correct translation is TUHAN not ALLAH

but insisting on ALLAH belies a sneaky agenda to "colonialise" the Malay Muslims

these "messiahs" were trained to convert Muslims right from the school levels

I was once "bribed" a visit to a rich man's mansion as a preliminary step towards their goals

instead of taking me round the mansion, they led me to a living room where we (about 5 of us) were told to remove our shoes, sit on a sofa, hold hands with everyone and close our eyes

then we heard this very melodious haunting music that has the effect of spell-binding you into a state of non-resistance and lethargy

a deep male voice then sang some lyrics and I thought it was a really great singing voice

after a while the music and singing stopped, then someone told us to open our eyes

when I opened my eyes I saw several wine glasses filled with a red liquid and a green olive

those glasses were not there at first - upon seeing the weird combination of colour of the drink - red sea with green blob, I suddenly realised that this is some "sinister" gathering

I asked my classmate whether I get to see the mansion? She was silent, so I got up, put on my shoes and walked out of the room and gate

I never once spoke to this Catholic Chinese girl ever again

Anonymous said...

mahkamah diadili orang kafir mesti la dia gunakan landasan perlembagaan langgar hak mutlak perkataan 'ALLAH". kalau nasrani laknatullah nak guna nama "ALLAH" boleh tapi dengan pergertian "ALLAH" SATU, bukan dua atau tiga dan sebagainya. Kalau sanggup boleh. Kalau tidak nak ikut kepala bapak mereka dan hakim laknatullah tu jangan sekali-kali dibiarkan, semua orang Islam dinegara ini harus bersatu menentang usaha jahat kafir laknatullah ini. kepada pemimpin Islam dalam kerajaan membiarkan perkara ini berpanjangan adalah dayus...Haramkan terbitan ni dan jangan bagi muka langsung.

trackers said...

said...

Ini perkara remeh...jika ada golongan yang nak memanggil Tuhan mereka Allah, apa yang kita boleh buat...kalau haramkan, dalam hati dia dia masih akan sebut Allah. Beginilah...kalau Kristian mengharamkan penggunaan 'God' oleh orang Muslim yang berbahasa Inggeris, adakah orang Islam akan marah?

aiyok NoMalayApologist...
nie bukan pasal haramkan diorg sebut nama Allah...
langkah kita menegah diorg guna perkataan 'Allah' dlm penerbitan cz nak mengelakkan kekeliruan di kalangan generasi baru n bdk2 yg lum cukup kuat pegangan agama ner..
cuba bygkn ank kita ader pergi kdai2 buku,n dalam buku tue byk tertulis word 'Allah'...tanpa usul periksa dia pon bli tnpa mgetahui yg buku tue ditulis oleh kristian..
last2 dia blk dia bc n trus folo...nauzubillah..

Anonymous said...

Haiya

Wake up people

This is a POLITICAL agenda, trying to exploit religion to "engineer" the masses

just like supporting PAS Nik Aziz to SPLIT the majority Malay Muslims

Anonymous said...

Haha

What happens if the catholics get confused that their Allah has a son and the Muslims' Allah has none

and that may be the start of catholics reading the QURAN and converting to Islam

Pasquale said...

Rocky,

Allah, Jahweh, God they all mean the same THE Mighty Supreme being, it is just a matter semantic. If we are a true believer of our faith no matter what we will always be true of our faith.
It is just that we are afraid a bunch of Muslim accidentally strayed onto a church and heard the pastor saying the word Allah in his Sunday sermon may mistook the sermon as Islam? I don't think so!
So may I wish all Malaysians Happy Rosh Hashanah!

Anonymous said...

I like to believe that the integrity of our judges are unquestionable at all times.

But because of many allegations of fixing of judges over the years, judges meeting trial lawyers overseas, Lingam tapes, Royal Commission etc, one sometimes strays from that belief. One is, after all, only human.

This "Malaysia's Allah" case is an example where one wonders whether the Judge has made a proper decision. Of course, there are the Appeal and the Federal Courts for KDN to exhaust their legal avenue. One even wonders whether it was intended so - allow a non-Muslim Judge to sit on an Islamic matter knowing that whatever the outcome, there are two other levels to seek redress. If, ultimately, the ruling will favour KDN, even Chritians would have been happy at least now and perhaps more willing to accept a different decision later.

Perhaps it's the sign of the times. So many things appear not quite right in the counry for a long time and they are not getting better now. Such that one's mind wonders places at times. One even wonders where Najib is going these days.

Anonymous said...

Daripada apa yang berlaku daripada episod ini, menegakkan Negara Islam sebenar semakin mendesak. Umat Islam harus bersatu agar Syiar Islam di martabatkan. Tidak ada gunanya jika majority sebagai Islam diperkotak-katik kan oleh Kafir laknatullah. Niat utama Kristian di Malysia adalah jelas untuk mengkristiankan anak cucu kita dalam jangka masa panjang. To CH18, you are the one who are BLODY RACIST. This is about Religion not race!!!! A ricist mind will look at everything as racist!!!!!!!

bill get said...

Bru,

Haqhahahahha..

This is just a 1000 & 1 nite story from UMNO stupidity..

This is the proof after 53 years(ISA) UMNO still lame as F***..

Power To Serve (NOD!)

Anonymous said...

anwar ibrahim harus bertaubat!!

Fazli Salleh said...

Ini bukan salah PAS, UMNO atau PKR kerana ianya diputuskan oleh mahkamah. Perkara ini adalah kerana kebodohan orang cerdik pandai di negara kita yang menggubal akan segala undang-undang tetapi lupa untuk menggubal undang-undang untuk meng"eksklusif"kan perkataan "Allah" hanya kepada orang Islam.

Sepatutnya kita mengambil iktibar dari Turki yang lebih kurang 90 tahun merdeka. Mereka meletakkan pada perlembagaan mereka yang turki adalah negara sekular selagi wujudnya Turki dan perlembagaan tersebut tidak boleh dipinda. Oleh itu, sesiapa memerintah pun tak akan timbul isu meng"Islam"kan Turki.

Inilah akibat pemimpin yang pandai cakap.

Mereka yang kafir mahu mengkristiankan umat Islam di negara ini dengan menggandakan bahan bacaan menggunakan perkataan Allah. Umat Islam akan terkeliru lalu terpesonglah akidah mereka. Oleh itu, menjadi tanggungjawab kerajaan yang memerintah serta alim ulama seluruh Malaysia menggandakan usaha dakwah Islamiah.

Allahu Akbar, Allah itu tidak beranak dan tidak berbapa.

Anonymous said...

It is appalling to note that no immediate reaction is made by any party(ies) that so precipitously jump into other issues of petty significance (like Dr. Asri's case, or the speed of calling other muslim as heretics when one do something so petty and insignificant). This, I think is the single most significant issue of Nadrah proportion that touches the very fabric of our constitution.

It is also appalling to note that UMNO or PAS has not said a thing about this (hello, where is the PEMUDA UMNO or PAS?) Do these peoples only say things when they start seeing political advantage to them... so I say damn be unto you! You are unprincipled in your struggle! (if there is any).

It is well accepted and documented that the word Allah in the Malaysian muslim context refers to the one God that muslim have faith in. Why would others now wants the use of the term in their faith to also be Allah? Has that been the case from the days long past? Is this term being used in their Books as it is in Qur'an?

I believe some of the earlier comments have clarified this..and these questions beg for answers. Please all the revered scholarly individuals do clarify this issue for the sake of muslims. WAllahu 'Alam bissawab.

-the Concerned-

borhan said...

They want everything under the sun.Be it special right, bumiputra status etc..blah..blah.. blah.. Indeed they are very special and have all the hak istemewea more than what the bumiputra have. Now they want Allah as well. Actually their god is Ilah not Allah. That's the the shahadah goes as "There is no god (Ilah) but Allah".

Anonymous said...

YES ROCKY, u are right, kan ada "court of appeal"....takut apa, they can right the wrong. Maybe Monday, any one judge can give a stay order lah.....thanks rocky...we are moving faster with people like you around.....toward joining the "elite" dooms club...

Abdi Allah said...

"Dan janganlah kamu berdebat dengan Ahli Kitab, melainkan dengan cara yang paling baik, kecuali dengan orang-orang zalim di antara mereka, dan katakanlah: 'kami telah beriman kepada (kitab-kitab) yang diturunkan kepada kami dan yang diturunkan kepadamu; Tuhan kami dan Tuhanmu adalah satu ; dan kami hanya kepadaNya berserah diri'".- Al-Quran 29:46

Anonymous said...

To me, there is only one God. Allah or others, we worship to the Maker.

Having said that, will the church and non-Muslims in Malaysia accept it if the Government changes one of the Rukun Negara tenets to:
"Kepercayaan Kepada Allah"

I am sure the non-Muslim fanatics will start protesting loudly and vote against Barisan government.

By the way, I am a non-Muslim. a very confused and dejected Malaysian under the circumstances.

LIVE AND LET LIVE

sarawakian77 said...

Dear Rocky

Sorry to hear that you are under the weather this New Year. Though honestly all this nonsense began with certain political parties branding themselves defenders of this and that, when honestly, I think Malaysians will do better without those jokers.

Please, posters of comments, do refrain from posting clearly inflammatory remarks, because this is case is clearly a joke.

However you rationalise this matter, it is clearly a bad way to resolve the problem. Bringing this matter to a secular court will not resolve a theological problem. I say this because I think the Herald is acting pridefully, without any sense of humility or concern. Their decision is an act of pride, not one of humility. They are worried of earthly matters, and matters of the faith should be addressed accordingly.

Personally all Catholic/Christian literature in Malaysia should do away with the term "Allah". It's confusing. No need to stoke religious flames any further, as clearly there are just NOT ENOUGH rational-thinking people out there to discuss this calmly (evident from the postings here). A resolution should have been at an inter-faith discussion, not some random court house.

Also for the Home Ministry, they should not have resorted to threats & coercion to renew permits etc. But that is how they work, and I feel that is totally irresponsible of them.

I believe it is up the government & all parties involved to resolve this matter quickly. If you decided drag dirty linen like this in the open, then it is up to you as public figures (both the govt, Islamic religious departments, and the Church) to settle this.

Happy New Year 2010.

Anonymous said...

Dear Rocky, your true colors are only now coming out.

Tom

Anonymous said...

To my muslim brothers and sisters, please refer to the Quran, Surah Al-Ankabut (Spider)29:46 and onwards. From here you shall be guided correctly and you would not worry about the Court's decision to allow the Christians or Jews to use Allah. Only Muslims who are not willing to read the quran and to understand it would take offense with the court's decision.
Habib RAK

Anonymous said...

happy new year.

please visit http://lanunth.blogspot.com to know what's brewing in Tabung Haji.

Retro said...

I stand corrected but in response to the point made by Syed Akbar Ali and Eddy, I believe that the Herald has a distribution of about 15,000 and the restrictions placed on the publishers by the Home Ministry is that it is not circulated to Muslims.

Thus, the Home MInistry's ruling has effectively made the Herald a non-public document.

In this event (and I stand corrected as I have never seen the yearly renewable licence provided by the Home Ministry and make this assumption based on reading past newspaper reports), the judge has not erred as Article 11(4) does not apply simply because the Herald is not available to the public.

If Rocky's Bru could perhaps obtain a copy of the licence and post it in this blog, that might clarify matters based on the facts.

Eddy's view that the Malaysian Civil Court may not be the best place to make a decision on this is debateable. There are 2 legal systems in this country - civil and syariah. The matter at hand dels with the issuance of a printing licence. Does the Syariah Court rule over who prints what in Malaysia ? I don't think so and as such, it needs to be dealt with in the Civil Court.

In matters of religion, there is a organisation called Malaysian Consultative Council of Buddhism, Christianity, Hinduism, Sikhism and Taoism (MCCBCHST). It should have included Islam, but I don't know why it does not.

There is another interfaith organisation called Malaysian Interfaith Network which does include Sisters in Islam and IIU but not Majlis Fatwa Kebangsaan.

An interfaith council could have provided a means to resolving inter-religious issues but again, this is a legal matter dealing with the issuance of a printing licence.

As the Herald has been in print for a number of years, I believe that the people in the Home Ministry in the years past, must have studied the legal ramifications and thus approved the permit with restrictions to conform with the Federal Constitution.

As far as I can tell, those relevant Articles in the Constitution have not changed. Therefore, based on the recent High Court ruling, the Home Ministry then was correct in its application, i.e it is back to status quo.

It will be interesting to hear the DPP's arguments should there be an appeal.

Anonymous said...

Friend,
If the Arabs don't have issues with christians calling God as Allah, why some of you are so adamant in having exclusivity of having Allah.
Wah, if that's the case, perhaps, we christians should ban moslems from using Jesus as a mere prophet then.
Aiyah, please don't be a moron lah

Anonymous said...

There's no god but God. Tiada tuhan melainkan Tuhan yang satu. There's no illah but Allah.

People of the Books..
We have only Allah, the one and only God. It's only how we believe and worship Him that is different...

Hantu Gigi Jarang

Anonymous said...

Anon 2,51am
"Kasi PAS bawa ke depan"...fat chance la bro. Takut nanti lonie marah. Kes take beer pun kena kow
tow. Naively I had wasted my vote on this bulan gerhana.
Rozi66

Anonymous said...

The Judiciary is an important governing arm of any nation like the Executive and the Legislative arms.Each watches the other therein of which stand one whole.
It's decisions and objectivity are vital ingredients for the enabling the effective complete running of any country.
In the current matter the judgement was objective enough based on the information data available.
Much ado is avoided if respect to principles of adherence in regards to objectivity is followed and respected by respectable parties thereon.
=Plato=

Anonymous said...

Rozi66,
Just cant understand it. Why why why???? out of sooo many other names it still want to use ALLAH. Just another way to confuse the moslem? Testing our patience?..Sure parti kompiuskan rakyat very happy with it. Their leaders say ok also.. can get more vote too. My backside to these people la.

to Anon 2.51am,
"kasi PAS aja bawa isu ni kedepan"....fat chance la bro. Nanti lonie malah. "Takebeer" kes pun kena kowtow. They all sedang sebok mengkronikan diri...tak pa can go to heaven maa.
And naively I did waste my vote for this bulan gerhana.
Sad sad new year day for me. :-(

Anonymous said...

Kalau pada pendapat aku, perkataan Allah memang digunakan dalam berbagai "contexts" di negara Arab, sebab Allah itu maksudnya tuhan. Jadi tiada salahnya jika orang Kristian menggunakan perkataan Allah (dari segi "context" bahasa Arab). Tetapi dalam segi "contexts " Melayu, mungkin lain sikit sebab orang Melayu; aku sendiri pun tak tahu maksud Allah itu tuhan, sehingga lah membuat bacaan sedikit. Yang risaunya adalah apabila orang Melayu yang tidak tahu bezakan antara duanya, budak sekolah contohnya. Jadi kefahaman tentang Islam akan bercampur, sekejap Allah itu ada tiga, sekejap ada satu, contohnya. Kecualilah kalau orang PAS mahu membuat kempen kesedaran/perbezaan antara dua makna Allah itu memandangkan mereka menyokong penggunaan Allah oleh Kristian, tapi tak pulak dengarnya!!

Kesimpulannya, "if its not break, don't touch it" Sekian lama orang Kristian boleh je berkembang, kenapa tiba-tiba bising pasal ini pula? Dalam bible bahasa Inggeris pun tak guna Allah. Apa motif?

-koko

Anonymous said...

"Well, i dont know about you guys but I am confident that my faith in Islam and Prophet Mohammad PBUH is too strong to be swayed by anything as petty as this. My jihad is a battle within to make myself a better Muslim. Personally, I couldnt care less about how other people choose to call their God."

Dengan kata pendeknya, maksud kau "kubur masing-masing" lah...

Hmmm.... kalau para sahabat fikir macam itu dulu, orang Melayu tak peluk Islam lah jawapnya.

-koko

austozi said...

Why should it matter that the judge was not a Muslim? The verdict was delivered not in a Syariah court, not according to Syariah law! The dispute was not whether the the Quran or Hadith allows the term 'Allah' to be used by Herald to refer to the Christian god, but whether Malaysian federal law (not Islamic!) allows it! As long as the judge is learned in Malaysian federal law, then regardless of his religious belief, he's well qualified to deliver that verdict. If you can't even understand this simple difference, then shame on you.

LIN LIANI said...

1) Fikiran rakyat kita masih sempit bahawa Islam kononnya hanya dianuti Melayu sahaja. Sebab itulah berlakunya sentimen perkauman apabila mahkamah membuat keputusan memihak kepada Majalah Herald. Keputusan mahkamah perlu kita hormati dan kita tunggu keputusan merayu selepas ini pula.

2) Malaysia's Allah. Itulah tajuk yang diberikan Rocky's bru. Memang menarik dan tidak salah dituliskan tajuk itu setelah mahkamah membuat keputusan memihak kepada Majalah Herald. Nampak macam telah memenuhi konsep 1Malaysia - satu perkataan yang sama, iaitu 'Allah' boleh diguna bersama-sama oleh seluruh rakyat Malaysia.

3)Walaupun keputusan telah dibuat mahkamah,demi menimbulkan perasaan sensitif, apa kata pihak Herald guna 'Tuhan Allah' dengan menggantikan 'Allah' kerana perkataan 'Allah' sudah diketahui umum bahawa ia lebih sesuai digunakan Muslim?

Muna said...

CH18 --
and becos rocky said what he said, he is a bloody racist?

tell me -- what is this whole issue about?

tell me -- why is the Church so insistent on using the word "Allah"?

why is it a Muslim is a racist when it gets very suspicious of the church for insisting and taking the government to court -- to use the word "Allah"?

certainly not for the love of Allah -- the Allah that Muslim worships.

Yeah, yeah...tell me about the fact that the Arab Christians and whatnot use the word "Allah".

Are you guys Arabs?

And then your supporters rejoice that the herald can now use the word "Allah".

Are you, CH18 a racist yourself.

I have read the judge's remarks. i don;t agree with her.

Anonymous said...

CH18, you RACIST bigot!!! I know you are so eager to take over this country for your own people. RACIST scum bag

Anti CH18

Anonymous said...

"...On Feb 16, Archbishop Tan Sri Murphy Pakiam filed for a judicial review on the usage of the word "Allah" in the church's publications, naming the Home Ministry and the government as respondents..."

I strongly believe the concerted effort to file for the judicial review is malafide. They can always do and be fine without the word 'Allah' in the first place.

Why go for the trouble? Provoking?

Hatihitam

Anonymous said...

This RACIST government all along has conveniently ignored its universal use among Christians in the Middle East.
Yahoooooooooooo
Racki I say thanks to ALLAH for this ruling.

Jenn

aliah said...

i read with interest and concern, a comment by someone - in facebook" - who said this:

"Allelulia ! The High Court has declared that the Herald CAN use the word Allah. It is not exclusive to Islam. It also declares the Home Ministry's order as illegal, null and void ! Now we're coming out of the "dark ages" -

we're coming out of the dark ages because a high court ruled that a catholic magazine can use the word "Allah".

we're coming out of the dark ages because the catholic church wants to use the word "Allah".

how nice that the Catholic Church now wants to use the word "Allah".

Nice?

Nice?

Or...just to prove a point that you Muslims -- and the government led by a Malay/Muslim party -- can now fly kite.

arzawahiri said...

This shows tht the Christians are confuse and desprate. Islam is winning. Allah is really the greatest tht even christians want to associate their faith with the Almighty.

Anonymous said...

U fucker purposely misinterpret the whole issue. God is God and allah is no christian god. The issue here is that Allah is the Bahasa Malaysia word for God. Faham ka. And that is all. And the christian god can be called by other names in other diffrent languages. if the hindus want to trabnslate god as sami, why not.

nicholas

Anonymous said...

There has been many postings saying that in Bahasa 'God' is 'Allah' but isn't 'God' in Bahasa 'Tuhan' ? nampak sangat kafir kafir sekarang dah berani nak kurang ajar dengan kita if this happened to them we will be labeled a racist and by the way all PKR fella's this ain't about politics this is religion don't mess with it...r67

jacob said...

if muslims take exception to this whole episode, it's not because they want exclusive right to the word "Allah".
It makes us so suspicious of, as you say, the insistence, to use the word.
whether or not there is a motive, really we wouldn't know.
but the fact that the archbishop gone to such trouble to take the government to court does make us wonder, WHY?
is it for the love of the word "Allah"? and since when? oh -- since they discovered that it is a good word to use.
and please, let go that tired argument that arab christians have used it for a long time.
Allah is God in arabic? I'm not sure. perhaps. regardless.
But Allah is not God in Malay. The translation is "tuhan".
but, forget this argument.

i am questioning too. WHY this insistence and going to great length to be allowed to use the word?

will confusion reign with the use of Allah in bibles which i presume will be written in bahasa malaysia?

i'm sure there will be some confusion. Come on...don't plead ignorance.

but whether this confusion will cause (some) malay muslims to be converted, remains to be seen.
for now, this is unimportant.

for sure, there is unpleasantness, to put it mildly, because the use of Allah in holy books other than the quran or books on Islam in this country, will not go down well with malay muslims who incidentally account for the majority of the population.

even right-thinking, level-headed muslims are wondering WHY...

fatima said...

i don't recall Christians in Malaysia wanting to use the word "Allah" before.

heck, the word has always frightened them.

"Allahuakbar" (Allah is great) frightened(s) them.

Perhaps, Christians in malaysia have moved on. they are now more open, more knowledgeable because they're now talking about the universal use of the word "Allah", about it being usedin the Arab world. so why can't non-muslims use it in malaysia?

yeah, why cannot?
what's your problem, muslims?

as far as i know, it is not universal. there is no universal use of the word "Allah" to refer to god in christianity.
the churches in America, the vatican, do not use the word "Allah".

In the arab world, yes. because it is the Arab world where arabic is spoken. it is acceptable there.

since when has it been acceptable in malaysia?

since people realize they can take everything to court; since non-muslims feel they can now challenge and anything islam and islamic.

fine and good. democracy is not dead.

it does look like non-malays/non-muslims now want to put malay muslims in their place.
oh. i maybe wrong. i hope i am. but it does make me wonder if there is some sinister...

and that is why this issue will continue to burn.

Anonymous said...

Hey, what don't the Christians give their GOD other names. There are many other names. You guys can call him McDonald, Bush or Obama. Why want to copy other religion god's name. Ohh ... I know, Islam has a nice name for god.
IN few years time, you may change your Bible name to Al-Quran too if you like. Well, AL-Quran is a nice name for a holy book.
Then, change your church name too Mosque
Hey, better yet, why don't you all Christians become Muslim. SO we can share every nice name. Come on ... we welcome you

Muslim

Saya Rakyat Malaysia said...

ini adalah agenda kafirrun untuk menawan dan menjajah Malaysia. satu guna nama Allah, kata ganti Tuhan mereka. Lama-lama, mereka boleh claim jadi bumiputera pula. Tuhan dah sama, mengamalkan cara hidup yang sama. apa boleh nak dikata.

Anonymous said...

ALAmak! here we go again!

If ALLAH is only meant for Muslims to use, then the entire muslims ard the world shld get this done right! Why only banned here in Malaysia?

Again it is a race for "someone" trying to be more of "someone" than the others. Just like Ridhuan T trying to be more malay than the malays.



niaseng!

Anonymous said...

hey! MAny ppl here are so pious, Defending their God / Allah.

But i wonder how many actually fear their God / Allah? Fear in that sense they dislike sins. Fear as in they do not dwell in sinful things like corruption, condoning corruption, and putting someone who is sinful in office.

All talk kalk big la!




niaseng!

avatar said...

hehehhe...teringat cite avatar....ni pesanan untuk mereka2..

They've sent us a message... that they can take whatever they want. Well we will send them a message. That this... this is our land!

Anonymous said...

Allah God Sami all ONE so shut the F@#% UP ppl

Anonymous said...

Allah has 99 names which are His attributes.

Allah is not a generic name .
Tuhan is generic

Arabic generic for god is rabbi or ila.

If the herald wants to use Allah then the definition of Allah is seriously contradicting their definition of God. Unless they use the word tuhan. The herald is insulting christianity by rejecting the trinity.

antubiul said...

Most of the comment here shown ignorant due to the goverment mistakes to hold to their chest of the use of allah in the Bahasa speaking Christian in Sarawak. Also many peninsular Malaysia are always 'pening-sulah' since the fact is we do not know many news on the Borneo due to our own media that too much concentrate on stories in peninsular. The fact is the Bahasa speaking christian community has used the term Allah as their god for many centuries and probarly the judge did not erred. The sikh community (as what I understand) too use 'Allah' to refer to their god and I believed many Malaysian muslim are not aware of it. The point here is , if for many decades the community has been addresing their god as allah, should we now disallowed them to continue? If the malaysian muslim prohibit them that means we muslim are cruel since the correct way is to 'dakwah' them to embrace Islam. Yes in the Arab countries there is no issue of Allah term in Christianity since its their monther tounge while in Malaysian, its alien to the majority muslim . Malaysian muslim may need some time to accept the fact since in Malaysian Islam is Malay and Malay is Islam. This has not been an issue all this years until the day when then ministry cancel Herald permit and that the day we knew that Allah have been used in Christian world therefore who actually 'jolok sarang tebuan'?

Anonymous said...

The judgement was a horrible way to start the new year. It became worse when I read the insensitive bigotry comments from its supporters and all my comments against them not being published by Malaysian Insider.

The issue is simple and the bigots simply don’t want to understand. In BM there is a word "Tuhan" as in our rukun negara "Kepercayaan kepada tuhan". It has been used all this while to refer to God. Everyone's God. In BM also we have "Allah" which all this while connotes only the muslim's diety. That’s why we never say “kepercayaan kepada Allah”. All muslims and non muslims accept this and have lived harmoniously. Now why all of a sudden the Christians cannot use "Tuhan" is amazing. Are they trying to say that if they use “Tuhan” the so call east Malaysian Christians who can speak BM cannot understand. They have never been able to answer properly and logically why “Tuhan” cannot be used. To me its very sinister.

For those who don’t understand, a connotation or the way a word used is very important in a language. It is immaterial how the word has been used in Bahasa Indonesia or in Arabic but how its used in Malaysia. The fact is that in Malaysia we have harmoniously live with such terms of endearment. For christians to change you must have good ground for it. Why must you suddenly change now? How come “Tuhan” is not the right word? For those who don’t understand the importance of connotation let me put bluntly. The word "fuck" is a derogatory terms but some people used it often that it become harmless. But if you use "fuck" in malaysian society how do you think the guest would feel even though you use it often. Very offended wouldn't it? Coz there is a societal value to the meaning. The Americans can understand this and such usage is regarded as offensive.

So for muslims, the fact that in BM there is a word "tuhan" which has been used from time immemorial here in Malaysia to refer to “God”, the usage of “Allah” to refer to other non-muslims dieties are somewhat offensive with intent to humiliate. I and the majority of muslims will never be able to accept a blantant public signage in front of a church with the word "gereja yesus Allah" or "Yesus anak Allah". You can use "Tuhan" but to use Allah is offensive. We feel you are humiliating us with intent.

If you still cannot understand and feel that the language should be allowed to be used freely disregarding the connotation of the word, then I should be able to say to you "fuck you mother fucker" without impunity and you should not be offended. You don’t, right. You see where I’m coming from?

Anon C.

Anonymous said...

I personally pernah terjumpa satu tulisan dalam bahasa melayu yg berbentuk flyer yg ditinggalkan/tertinggal ditempat duduk sebuah bus stand kat Chow Kit. Ia mengandungi terjemahan ayat2 dari bible. Siap ada perkataan Allah..
Mulanya I just thought there were of a few translated verses from the Quran, tapi rupanya dari bible. Dia punya referal sources tu kecik je tulisannya sampaikan kalau tak perhatikan betul2, kita mungkin boleh overlooked.
Halusnya mainan pendakyah kristian ni...Kita mesti lawan..

zari

Remember1511 said...

It is all about the JESUITS again and again....this sun cult IHS clan done it again and again! Muslim should study about the JESUITS! try to figure out why they we're expelled from various country throughout the history!!

Christianity is declining throughout the west, so they turn to Asia instead...they want 1 billion instant converts! that's their target for Asia...i repeat 1 Billion!!! burn in hell IGNATIUS LOYOLA CLAN!!!

Anonymous said...

Is Packiam a Tan Sri? Why was he given a Tan Sriship? What contributions has he made towards the nation?

Is insisting on the word Allah contributing to the peace of the nation? Will that help in bringing about goodwill and harmony in the country?

Doesn't Catholicism teach moderation, goodwill and harmony? Doesn't he appreciate the fact that, while the Christian Arabs in Lebanon etc use the word Allah, it is because Allah is an Arabic word? Doesn't he realise that the situation is different in Malaysia where Arabic is not the lingua franca? Why didn't he, in the interest of moderation, goodwill and harmony, withdraw when Muslims in this country protested against his action? What is he trying to prove?

Is the word Tuhan not sufficient for him and his flock in this country? Who is the "Christian Allah" message intended to appeal?

Is it that, although the Herald is limited in distribution, by getting consent to use the word Allah, the group can later on use the word in spreading Christianity to whomsoever they choose? Those who are more familiar with the word Allah than the word Tuhan? Not just the Orang Asli in the Peninsular and the natives of Sabah and Sarawak?

Isn't that the hidden agenda? Isn't that a sinister and despicable intent? Isn't that a reflection of a lack of goodwill in maintaining the status quo? Why so, Packiam?

Anonymous said...

God and Allah are words used long ago, more than a thousand years and longer than when only Orang Asli inhabitant our land.

Anonymous said...

O Muslims in Malaysia. Set aside your petty differences for Islam to prosper here, for the future of Islam.

O Muslim leaders and people who have been vested in themselves with power. Us it to protect Islam and Allah will remember you when you are in need of His help.

Remain steadfast with Islam and do not let other wordly considerations weaken your unity.

arah said...

Sekurang kurangnya kita kongsikan ayat ayat berikut kepada kekawan Islam dan belum Islam

Say: O People of the Scripture! Come to a common word between us and you: that we shall worship none but God, and that we shall ascribe no partner unto Him, and that none of us shall take others for lords beside God. And if they turn away, then say: Bear witness that we are they who have surrendered (unto Him). (Aal ‘Imran 3:64)





Al-Ma'idah (The Table Spread)
5:17 (Y. Ali) In blasphemy indeed are those that say that Allah is Christ the son of Mary. Say: "Who then hath the least power against Allah, if His will were to destroy Christ the son of Mary, his mother, and all every - one that is on the earth? For to Allah belongeth the dominion of the heavens and the earth, and all that is between. He createth what He pleaseth. For Allah hath power over all things."

As exclaimed by Moses (pbuh): “Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one.” Deuteronomy 6:4.

“I am the Lord, and there is no other; apart from Me there is no God.”

Isaiah 45:5.




You shall have no other gods before me. You shall not make for yourself an idol in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God.”

Exodus 20:3-5

Jesus Christ (pbuh) said the following in the Bible:


“This is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.”

John 17:3

“How can you believe, when you receive glory from one another and you do not seek the glory that is from the one and only God?”

John 5:44

“The most important commandments,” answered Jesus, “is this: ‘Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, is one Lord’”

Mark 12:29

As described by Paul in his Letter to Timothy:

“Now to the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only God, be honor and glory forever and ever. Amen.”

1 Timothy 1:17

“Ekam evadvitiyam“

(He (God) is One only without a second.)

Chandogya Upanishad 6:2:1

Meaning in English: “Sages (learned Priests) call one God by many names.“

Rigveda 1:164:46

“Ma cid anyad vi sansata sakhayo ma rishanyata“

(O friends, do not worship anybody but Him, the Divine One. Praise Him alone.)

Rigveda 8:1:1


“Ekam Brahm, dvitiya naste neh na naste kinchan“

(There is only one God, not the second; not at all, not at all, not in the least bit.)

Brahma Sutra of Hinduism

“Ek Onkar, Sat Naam, Karta Purakh, Nirbhau Nirvair, Akal Murat, Ajuni, Saibham, Gurprasad”

(There exists but one God, who is called The True, The Creator, Free from fear and hate, Immortal, Not begotten, Self-Existent, Great and Compassionate.)

Granth Sahib, Mulmantra Pg.1

Meaning in English: “There is only the One Supreme Lord God; there is no other at all.”

Granth Sahib, Pg. 45

Meaning in English: “God is merciful and infinite. The One and Only is all-pervading.”

Granth Sahib, Pg. 710

Di zaman IT ni kita di beri perluang oleh Allah untuk berdakwah di pelusuk dunia. Sama sama kita mengambil kesempatan dgn menyebar ajaran Islam ni.

Sudahkah kita mengambil kesempatan tu???

Ya Allah terimalah usaha kami ini sebagai amalan soleh.

Anonymous said...

Is the bible so inadequate as to need borrow the term Allah in it's description?

In the Quran, there is no need to borrow any term from other religions. It is complete.
I urge my Christian Malaysians to ponder on this.

Anonymous said...

This insistence on the use of ALLAH has nothing to do with religion or language.

The actual correct linguistic translation for GOD is TUHAN.

This is another political attempt after having failed to put anwar, paklah, kj, zaid, nik aziz as their puppets.

It is all about LAND GRAB and dominance not only in economy but also in politics.

And don't let the paid distractors/commenters convince you otherwise.

Some quarters feel acute PAIN watching Malaysia succeed smoothly and perpetually when they in another context have only succeeded to leap frog in a sprint race for a short while, only to discover they can't complete the triathlon, from sheer breathlessness and lack of stamina.

Anonymous said...

If muslim does not make this a big fuss who else will? It does smell like a sinister plot, go to the great length of bringing this to court, to test the resolve of muslims perhaps?

Judges should be wise in their decision, don't just take the letter of the law but also the spirit of the law. Is the law promulgated to cause confusion and chaos? I guess that's a true test of wisdom in judges. For why are they called "Yang Arif" if they are not... Let history be lessons not just learning.

- the Concerned -

Anonymous said...

Kata nama am for god is tuhan not Allah. Kalau nak pakai nama tuhan org lain pi amik nama Siva ke Vishnu..depa pun tuhan somebody juga. Awat sibuk nak nama kan God depa Allah..??? pelik.. and please make sure we appeal to a judge yg lebih faham bahasa.

tigakale said...

Kafir harbi all of you still got time...Original PEKIDA got numbers...

Anonymous said...

Part 1

My last take on the 'ALLAH" issue:

The etymology of a word posits that its origins and coinage is essentially socio-cultural and dictated by prevailing circumstances. In other words, a term comes into existential being through popular and widespread use as the case of "credit crunch" implies (see Star, print edition, 30/12).
The term ALLAH ,in Arabic, came into being as the universal address for the Almighty amongst the Semitic racial group ever since Adam alahisalam. Ibrahim (as), Musa (as) and Isa (as) being fellow Muslims and receipients of the early syariats of Islam continued that usage and it should be of no surprise that the term gained currency through their proselytisation and became common parlance amongst the Arabs as is prevalent today. The usage of Allah is,in its essence premised, on a monotheistic framework and to ascribe partners. sons and lovers and ghouls to the Almighty is shirk to say the least and Muslims who consent to this are murtads who have left the pale of Islam

There are Muslims who quote from the Quran to justify such usage. Be reminded that in elucidating the revealation, the Prophet Nuhammad (peace upon him and his family)merely endorses the monotheistic conceptualisation of Allah. Hence when he says the Lord of "the Ahlul Kitab and the Mukmin......" as in Ali Imran, he is merely emphasising the Oneness of the Almoghty (the essence tauhidism) and nothing more for who is the Prophet but the seal of the lineage that harks back to Adam and isnt he the inheritor of the monotheistic faith as preserved by the Najran Hunafas (hanifs). It is also this unassailable adherence to monotheism that is alluded to by a famous hadith that proclaims that the world will never end as long as the kalimah" there is No god Except Allah" is kept alive. The term Allah then is the crux of Islam, the essence of which is encapsulated succintly in Al-Ikhlas" while Islam's unique position as a belief system not to be commingled and contaminated with man-made cults is emphasised in Al-Kafirun.

Arsewhore, Shah Alam Crossbearer, Turban Munafucking Nikki or even Bee Lans aside, it should not be lost on my fellow Muslims that despite using Allah in their liturgy, Syrian and Egyptian Copts, Lebanese Maronites and Palestinian Christians etc have not embraced Islam..so u can chew the cud until the cock crows seven and yet see your Catholic neighbour toting a "Allah" bible at your gates, till as they say "kingdom come".
Monotheism has never been the raison d'etre ith the heretic Jewish and Christian cults, the latter a polythistic spawn of the Abrahamaic monotheism. In fact,those well-versed in Christian philosophical, liturgical and eccelesiastical polemics would be aware of the fact that one of the main causes of divergence between Catholicism and the Calvin-Luther-Zwingli inspired Protestant reform movement was the trenchant idolatry (Mariolatry), liturgical and eccelesiatical schisms pervadig Catholicism exacerbated by the all-pervasive influence of their priesthood in all sphers of life.Hence, dont be surprised by the anak A....., Roh...... etc rubbish in the Catholic Herald which would be akin to dragging the sacrosanct term through the gutter, a diabolical spiritual insult if ever there was one !

Warrior 231

Greenbottle said...

IMITATION is the best form of FLATTERY.

though in case of christians, since they think that jesus is the son of god or even god in human form , it must be clearly understood by christians that this is a complete anathema to muslims.

to call one jew a god is no more and no less than calling a PIG a god. it makes absolutely no difference as both in muslims' faith is considered false.

so logically (?) catholic's ALLAH is nothing more than a PIG. and that's why all muslims are so worked up...

so i propose in catholic's bible the word god should be written thus, it may be a bit longish but better defined the concept for them: ALLAH(jew boy/pig/whatevah)

Anonymous said...

Part 2

The judgement itself reeks of unfathomable absurdities.

1.Justice Lau Bee Lan also declared that under Article 3(1) of the Federal Constitution, applicant Titular Roman Catholic Archbishop Tan Sri Murphy Pakiam had the constitutional right to use “Allah” in the Herald in the exercise of his right that religions other than Islam might be practised in peace and harmony in the country.

Q: How can there be peace and harmony when the crux of the issue relates to a term entwined with tauhidism (monotheism) and sacrosanct to Islam the religion of the Federation.


2. She further ruled that the Constitution, which states Islam as the country’s religion, did not empower the minister to make such a prohibition.

Q: This is an absurdity as clause 5 of Article 11 pertaining to religious freeedom implicitly allows for this:
"This Article does not authorize any act contrary to any general law relating to public order, public health or morality". (Clause 5 Art 11)
Further clause 2(a) of Article 10 is clear in its imputation and the same clause would automatically abrogate any right to free speech if such speech causes incitement to any offence. Hence it would be preposterous to say that the Minister had failed to provide any evidence of threat to national security for isnt indirectly besmirching another belief system through the utilisation of its core constructs (when alternatives (eg:tuhan) are readily available)constitute "incitement".

The fact that the judge deemed the Minister deficient in proving any threat cannot obfuscate other more important issues i.e., how did she arrive at the judgement without first etymologically elucidating the origins of the term "Allah"? What tests of logic did she use to deduce that the term is generic? Why are other alternative and uncontroversial terms not apllicable in this context? Did she study the implications of substituting "Allah" in the said contexts and evaluate the consequences of such applications before deducing that such usage/ translations would not be incendiary? If so, whom or what precedents/circumstances did she refer to in arriving at her decision and were they were made available for scrutiny or coss-examination?

Further if the CH is merely for circulation amongst the Christian laity, what measures are in place to ensure that such is the case ( we know of previous attempts at controlling the Harakah. dont we?) + how if the CH is distributed via photocopying or other similar means of dissemination

In conclusion, there are more questions than answers that meet the eye as nebolous judgements are wont to generate and it would be interesting how these are answered in the written grounds. I await in anticipation.

Warrior 231

ah pong said...

there is at least one brand of "three in one" shampoo in the market.

since this absolutely describe the concept of god in christianity (at least the catholic version) may i propose the herald to translate their word "god" as PANTENE?.

i think it has a nice ring to it.

Anonymous said...

"hey! MAny ppl here are so pious, Defending their God / Allah.

But i wonder how many actually fear their God / Allah? Fear in that sense they dislike sins. Fear as in they do not dwell in sinful things like corruption, condoning corruption, and putting someone who is sinful in office.

All talk kalk big la!

niaseng!"


I would like to suggest instead of using the name Allah why not use the name "niaseng the annoying know all".
You stop your pork eating, beer swilling, rude behaviour and bad habits first before we can consider your sarcasm.
Always saying something but never anything smart.

peeedah!

Anonymous said...

What the Catholics have gained here is being offset by increased feelings of suspicion and wariness against them.


Trust No One.

Anonymous said...

Ulasan hakim memberi alasan macam otak belik ... sengaja mencari huru hara.

Tu lah Hakim guna akal logic. Kerajaan patut pantau semua ugama supaya tidak ada ajaran songsang pada ugama itu sendiri.

Mana UMNO yang islamic senyap je, mana Pak haji PAS kaku je.

Anonymous said...

xxx,

pakatan followers were right all along! the judiciary in malaysia sucks. unfair. populist.

xxx.

antubiul said...

'Again it is a race for "someone" trying to be more of "someone" than the others. Just like Ridhuan T trying to be more malay than the malays'- Anon.

Ridhuan T is not trying to become more malay than malay and probrably he is tired when people like you thought beside converting to Islam he too wanted to convert to 'Malay'. The fact is Ridhuan T is trying his all best to remind some of the Chinese to be more realistics and understanding.He is also explaining to them Islam is not Malay and when you convert you are converting your belief not your race neither am cultural. In a way you dont die for not eating pork since there are many chicken around therefore tolerance is the key point to harmony.

Freddie Kevin said...

Warrior231,

To all Muslims. I am a catholic and strongly do not agree and object to this deed being pursued by the Archdiocese.

While it dwells upon freedom of expression, it goes against the very foundations of peaceful harmony among Malaysians of all religions.

I believe that the real parties to this action are politicians and find it particularly strange and peeved that our Archbishop is not seeing the woods for the trees.

There is an alternative ie Tuhan, yet these irresponsible parties are going about frivolously insisting on a matter of law!

No matter what the law may decide, if it is offensive to any religion the matter MUST be dropped, period.

I, for one, would like to apologise to all aggrieved Muslims for the very great distesss and concern that this issue has caused.

Yours truly
Freddie

Anonymous said...

Allah yang menjadikan orang Kristian, jadi Allah juga adalah tuhan orang Kristian. Orang Islam wajib percaya ini. Kalau tidak aqidah mungkin tak betul..
Hantu Gigi Jarang

Anonymous said...

Please check with DBP what is god in malay, is tuhan lah dungu- sekolah dulu tak belajar bahasa melayu ka dungu

anti dungu

Anonymous said...

Sungguh mengujakan isu ini di tahun baru 2010. Saya seorang beragama Buddha and hidup semenjak kecil membesar Dan bergaul dengan masyarakat Melayu. Secara peribadi saya rasa penganut agama Kristian tidak perlulah terlalu mendesak untuk penggunaan perkataan Allah dalam terbitan Herald. Pendapat ini adalah berasaskan kepada berikut :-

1. Siapakah golongan sasaran penerbitan mereka? Orang Melayu beragama Islam adalah dilarang sama sekali Dari Murtad atau tukar agama. Jadi apa perlu terbitan Berbahasa Melayu atau Inggeris menggunakan perkataan Allah. Saya amat bersetuju dengan pandangan hak exclusive penggunaan perkataan Islam untuk umat Islam seperti perkataan Sony. Atok saya selalu menggunakan perkataan "Tuan Ala" untuk merujuk kepada Allah apabila merujuk kepada Tuhan ketika bercakap dengan orang Melayu.

2. Apakah rasionalnya berebut penggunaan perkataan Allah sekiranya ianya lebih banyak menimbulkan kekeliruan daripada pemahaman. Usahlah gunakan perkataan tersebut jika ia membawa lebih keburukan daripada kebaikan dalam erti kata sebenarnya seperti menjejaskan keharmonian hidup bermasyarakat ataupun keselamatan negara.

3. Kenapa alim ulama Islam mendiamkan diri daripada memberi pandangan? Adakah mereka juga ragu-ragu?

4. Manusia di dunia sanggup berkorban jiwaraga Demi mempertahankan 5 perkara tunjang dalam hidup ini iaitu Kebebasan (Freedom); Agama (Religion); Cinta (Love - kekasih ataupun tanahair); Kuasa (Power) Dan Wang (money). Jadi saya memahami kekecewaan sahabat beragama Islam di Atas keputusan tersebut.

5. Pemimpin BN nampaknya bersikap rasional dengan mengamalkan sikap tinggu Dan lihat. Kalau adapun Khir Toyo tetapi beliau hanya menunjukkan kekecewaan peribadi. Kalau pendapat diutarakan nanti nampak macam Ada campurtangan kerajaan dalam Sistem Kehakiman. Jangan lupa ini Akan digunakan sepenuhnya jika ianya berlaku untuk kes Anwar pada bulan Januari nanti. Di lush mati mak, ditelan mati bapak.

6. Dulu kes Hindraf satu negara kelam kabut. Sekarang penganut Kristian dipimpin oleh Pricham pula. Apa nak jadi orang Malaysia ini. Geli juga bila melihat Melayu Islam sendiri menyokong. Konfius saya dibuatnya. Jangan sampai gaduh gaduh sudah la.

Apek Kampung nak hidup Aman Damai kat negara ini, bila semua orang nak berebut rebut perjuangkan hak kaumlah; hak agamalah. Kalau semua orang tak tamak atau dengki nak berebut tak kecohlah negara kita.

Peace

sick&tired said...

Yawn, still fighting over petty stuff, no wonder we are still a 3rd world country. Malaysia Boleh!

Anonymous said...

Well, we could do a Lim Kit Siang - To Hell With The Law......

Why does one group (or any group) need to push the boundaries on sensitivity? What does this achieve? Principle of freedom of speech? What about the principle of peace, love and understanding, preached by the Church?

Mixed

Anonymous said...

The most important question is, what do they gain by doing this? I can I understand if its comes from Sabah/Sarawak since they use Allah for God before independence. But for the Peninsular? Where the Christian who mostly Chinese/Indian that speak English anyway. It is very surprising that these people who mostly speak English everyday wants to read bible in Malay with Allah to replace the word God.

Nah... its not about the few Chinese/Indian Christian, its about converting the Malays to Christian, that is why they fight hard for it.

Some people here who is so "alim" might not be confused, but its the not so "alim" one.

-kk

Anonymous said...

Looks like Christian religion have an identity crisis that they have to use Islamic's god to explain themself. Indonesia will call this "maling".

LOL Christian "maling" other people's god, ha ha ha ha ha ..... that's funny.

-koko

Anonymous said...

LOL why christian just stop at the word Allah, they should go further, change their church and call it mosque, change their Sunday prayer to Friday prayer, change their way of pray to five day prayer, eliminate the other two god to sync with islamic god, LOL they are so low confidence and imitator... ha ha ha

-koko

Anonymous said...

it would appear that the roman catholic church [RCC} of malaysia
is again
undergoing a transformation today when the leaders of the
RCC in Malaysia is seeking to use Allah as their God. This is
actually not new . The idea was first initiated by pastor
tiny mulken from netherland who had spent 8 years as a
pastor in Indonesia. Read more at

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,293394,00.html

In the 1500 s Martin Luther rejected the concept of buying
forgiveness and started a new branch of christianity.

Hopefully the leaders of the RCC would be brave enough to follow
the footsteps of Martin Luther in coming out with a truly
radical transformation that would lead roman catholics and
muslims truly share one true god , Allah -the one and only
;he begets nor is begotten a son.


Earlier when the RCC had voiced a campaign to use Allah as
god in their publication I had made known my objections
variously through writings in the blog. Having done a thorough
literature search on the net about the roman catholics and Allah
I have come to realize that it was foolish to object what was
in fact a very good thing. Earlier in my writings I was
influenced by the narrations of the role of the the catholic
priests and their intrigues in influencing the decision making
during the time of Elizabeth 1. The movies Elizabeth 1 and Elizabeth 2
would be a good start in getting to understand the psyche of the
catholic thinking.


In my earlier writings where I strongly objected the use of Allah by the catholics,
The beauuty of the possiblity that the catholics in malaysia may
simply want to use Allah as god and are willing to drop the
issue [or silent ] of the triunion god [my take] eluded me. It is by necessary
implication that the roman catholic leaders in malaysia are
silently agreeing to the unique god , Allah [as referred to
by muslims in the country ] when they seek the court's help
to get themselves the right to use Allah as their god in the malay translation of the bible.
Interestingly Martin luther too was instrumental
in getting the bible translated. As Islam , Christianity and Judaism
are the oldest religion and are related by the common god and prophets
it is logical that they address the common god as Allah. All
the reasons from the body of catholics and persons who opposed the
use of the word Allah are abundantly available for the leaders
of the RCC in malaysia to peruse from the following websites-



http://christianblogs.christianet.com/1187194406.htm
http://socrates58.blogspot.com/2007/11/does-catholic-church-equate-allah-and.html

http://www.albertmohler.com/?cat=Blog&cid=991

Despite all the negative comments in using Allah as god by bodies of
catholics and pastors, the RCC of malaysia
still want to get the court to approve the use of Allah as god.
The word Allah has a special meaning in the constitution. For over
50 years Allah has meant the one god ; he neither begets[has a son ]
nor is he begotten [born of someone].
. In simple translation -He has no son and was not born of someone.
Public policy considerations demands that the approval by the
judge [ Dato Lau] would carry an important corollary that the ALLAH
REFERRED TO IS ALLAH WHO HAS NO SON NOR is he born [begotten] so that
everyone is clear of the definition which has withstood the test of time
in malaysia.


Now we have seen the RCC malaysia wants a transformation and the
gomen under ds najib also wants a transformation . May i
suggest that our media -tv [earth and satellite ] , radio and papers
carry this new year message-


Salam 1 Malaysia di bawah naungan Allah yang satu- tiada
Ia beranak atau diberanakkan.

for all muslims , catholics and everybody who believe in the creator!



notoktok

Retro said...

Even Tun Dr M has acknowledged that the Christians in Sabah & Sarawak have long used the term as a representation of God. He also urged for strict restrictions to be placed on its usage.

Both points inidcate that he respects the law and the history of its usage.

Nonetheless, it appears an appeal will be lodged.

Anonymous said...

Having read all the comments I wonder if Muslims or anyone could be easily confused by the term "Allah" used by a small community's publication in parts of Malaysia.

If Muslims are easily confused, bear in mind the publication is strictly for Christian who use BM in certain part of Malaysia (Borneo) and had used the term for over 400 years, they must be stupid. Yes, Muslims are stupid if they cannot tell the difference in context of a term be it "Allah" or any other terms.

ChengHo said...

semangat 1Malaysia dah betul lah tu ; apa yg nak d komplin kan?
Dulu dah elok Muhibbah tukar 1 Malaysia..

Anonymous said...

Like I have said before ...

bala's SD, bala ala David Copperfield, Altantuya murderer, Hindu Najib, supervisor Rosmah, hero chin peng, racist BTN, correctX3, etc etc ...

the only common ground that all these events have is

to topple the Malay-led government and replace with the Malaysian Malaysia concept where the non-Malay is dominant

this could be a clear indication that an island is not doing too well in the long run

so it's time to wreck/sabotage the competitor while reminiscing about the immediate past as a form of apology

more to come folks - akan datang, coming soon to your blog

amir said...

Apparently, Yahweh and Jehovah are not good enough.

I once fought Jenova and her son, Sephiroth (No, not Tree of Sefirot) in Final Fantasy 7.

How about eloheim? Al-latta and Al-uzza?

Anonymous said...

sick&tired,

now, now, don't think too much about it. just think about how to fill your stomach.

viva 3rd world

Anonymous said...

The whole issue has become confused because it is being debated by West Malaysian politicians, bloggers etc. As Tun M has rightly pointed out the East Malaysian Christian Bumiputeras have been referring to God as Allah long before they were part of Malaysia. This usage of the word in their prayers, Indonesian translated bibles etc has been going on for hundreds of years. Are we saying that if the word is copy-righted by the West Malaysian Malays (since there seems to be no problem in the use of the word Allah everywhere else in the World), the Government is going to go around re-educating all the East Malaysians in their prayer forms and giving them new translated bibles and books (printed in Malaysia)? The BM section of the Herald is also meant to cater for the East Malaysian crowd. So please be sensible about the whole thing. No one is making a mockery of anyone else's religion. But East Malaysian Christians have a right to worship in their own way too, as is guaranteed by the Constitution.


Ju

Alex said...

Bloody job well done, Rocky. Your fixed deposit don't look so fixed no more. Show your true face to the peoples of Borneo. I think they can respond at the appropriate time using the most appropriate manner.

And yes God works in mysterious way..witness his judgment on UMNO..or is it NO?

Anonymous said...

Freddy,
While I am truly encouraged by your humbleness as exhibited by Christ (turning the other cheek), but like Christ, you must stood firm. Whether legally, constituitionally or even to the extent of your belief's in Christ, the issue here is simply the matter the use of word that's Allah
Lau Bee Lan has made the right decision of allowing the use of Allah for Christian in malay. Otherwise, there are serious repercussion.

Freddy,
Sabahans & Sarawakians are using Allah for their bibles for hurdred of years. Punjabis are using Allah too. Be it in Malaysia, UK or even India. Indonesians too. Remember Khir Toyo, even Sultan Selangor were descended from Indonesia.
Ah so, why shall we succumb to some weaklings moslems? Even Arab christians are using Allah. Some of these weaklings travelled around. This is an undeniable fact. So, what's the fuss?
Why not just ask Rocky Bru to close down Genting Casino instead? How come no sound at all from overzealous albeit weakling moslems? LKY in Singapore ban casino till now. Ah so.......

Freddy,
Beware the yeast of the Pharises.

Anonymous said...

You guys should read this

http://rantingsbymm.blogspot.com/2010/01/confident-people-do-not-get-confused.html

Anonymous said...

back then, we still learn Math & science in BM, yet they've failed. God is Tuhan not Allah.

Why la so greedy? You guys have all the names, still want Allah ah? Muslims only have one God -Allah...don't take it from us lah. Did your Tuhan teach you to be greedy or do you not have faith in your Tuhan, that you have to borrow from us?

People angry because it's fishy. And it's not because the sabahan & sarawakian only understood "Allah".

~anon11.55

tigakale said...

bloody hakim did word Allah mention in bible? Hidden agenda that for sure! Bloody hakim is it true that bible was the god's word? Yes was it...then what the hell that there are so many version...that's mean men's word not god or lord u bloody hakim!

Anonymous said...

Orang Melayu-Islam hari lembik, dayus. Islam-PAS sudah dicuck hidung, apanak buat. Berkuburlah Melayu-Islam di Tanah Melayu. Undilah PKR untuk mudah menghacurkan Islam.

Anonymous said...

Maybe, just maybe the word "LORD" to the Malaysian Christians have lost its supremacy due to the words being commonly used freely;

Lords of the Ring
Lord of the Jungle
English tittles, aloso use My Lord
Drug Lords
Even Drug Lords game aloso got
Go to the Courts aloso address the judges My Lord
etc,etc....

Maybe the Malaysian Christians also became pissed-off with the word "FATHER" due to questionable happenings around them;

- Instances where some biological fathers raped their own daughters/ granddaughters
- Abusive father come home drunk, beat the children and wife
- Watch their own father bankrupt the family's due to gambling and womanizing
- Read shocking and horrifying stories of those "Fathers" from their Churches sodomizing young boys in church compounds..

They searched for the ONE word and decided to change the word to "ALLAH", an exclusive pure flawless word used by 1.8b Muslims worldwide?

" Katakanlah (wahai Muhammad): (Tuhanku) ialah Allah Yang Maha Esa. Allah Yang menjadi tumpuan sekalian makhluk untuk memohon sebarang hajat. Dia tiada beranak dan Dia pula tidak diperanakkan..... DAN TIDAK ADA SESIAPAPUN YANG SERUPA DENGANNYA".

Mudah2an akan terbuka hati mereka mereka nih semua termasuk siPolan yang memulakan proses Mahkamah untuk memakai nama ALLAH, dengan harapan akan bersama menjadi saudara-saudara baru kita hendaknya...

PERWIRA

Anonymous said...

ah pong said...

... there is at least one brand of "three in one" shampoo in the market.

No, I think Shampoo is not universal enough as there are many men without hairs (botak)and will not require the use of shampoos...

I think drinks are more universal, they also comes 3-in-1..(I just had my Boh 3in1)..

BOH, NESCAFE, MILO, LIPTON?

A better choice BOH, Malaysian product, aloso got "O" and aloso just one syllable.

PERWIRA

Anonymous said...

TO MY MUSLIM "BN" BROTHERS & MY MUSLIM "PAS" BROTHERS; PLEASE UNITE FOR THE SAKE OF ISLAM. JANGAN BIARKAN ANAK & CUCU KITA DI SEKOLAH MENGENAL ALLAH YANG SALAH. JANGAN BENARKAN MEREKA TAAT & PATUH KEPADA ALLAH TANPA MENUNAIKAN SOLAT 5 WAKTU. KASIHANKANLAH ANAK & CUCU KITA WAHAIKAN RAKAN2 BN & PAS SEKELIAN. KETEPIKAN FAHAMAN POLITIK DEMI ANAK CUCU KITA.
-KUN FAYA KUN-

Anonymous said...

There are 2 points to ponder:

A. The name "Allah" derived from Arabic. It is not a Bahasa Malaysia name. Malays cannot claim it has their language.

B. The name "Allah" has been in existence prior to the advent of Islam. So, how can it be exclusive to any one religious group?

C. The Arab Muslims ( yes, there are Arab Christians its just that there are no Malay Christians) have not objected to the use of Allah as long it refers to God.



Think about this and not the narrow view that Malays are adopting without any basis. The Great Islamic Civilization of a thousand years ago would not have become great if they adopted such narrow views. For a change -THINK!

Very TIred Malaysian

Anonymous said...

In 628 AD, a delegation from St Catherine’s Monastery came to Prophet Muhammed and requested his protection. He responded by granting them a charter of rights, which I reproduce below in its entirety.

The Promise to St Catherine:

“This is a message from Muhammad ibn Abdullah, as a covenant to those who adopt Christianity, near and far, we are with them.

“Verily I, the servants, the helpers, and my followers defend them, because Christians are my citizens; and by God! I hold out against anything that displeases them.

“No compulsion is to be on them. Neither are their judges to be removed from their jobs nor their monks from their monasteries. No one is to destroy a house of their religion, to damage it, or to carry anything from it to the Muslims' houses.

“Should anyone take any of these, he would spoil God's covenant and disobey His Prophet. Verily, they are my allies and have my secure charter against all that they hate.

“No one is to force them to travel or to oblige them to fight. The Muslims are to fight for them. If a female Christian is married to a Muslim, it is not to take place without her approval. She is not to be prevented from visiting her church to pray. Their churches are to be respected. They are neither to be prevented from repairing them nor the sacredness of their covenants.

“No one of the nation (Muslims) is to disobey the covenant till the Last Day (end of the world).”

This is written by Marina Mahathir, daughter of Mahathir Mohammed, I was told.

Anonymous said...

Which God are these people reffering to Allah?

Is it The Father or The Son? or the Holy Spirit?

There are some stupid chingkies here who are confused with the word God in malay..God = Tuhan (malay)..that's is so expected from a typical pendatang who failed to recognized & understand his/her national language..

Can't make up your mind, eh? So why go all the way with those trouble..? Hidden agendas or menifestation of stupidity? Senjata makan tuan?

By the way, please inform the andartu bitch who is a Catholic herself who once complained against the azan early in the morning as a noise disturbance to perform a self-cunninglingus..eat your own shit now idiot!

Azan is a called of Allah-u-akbar..meaning "Allah is Great!" ..Dare to complain about Allah, hah idiot? do you called yourself a Catholic then?

So funny..pathetic idiot! Sendiri sudah kena..

:D muhahaha
-anti hindraf & ultra chingkies-

All roads lead to the same destination said...

Making a mountain out of a linguistic molehill ... open your eyes and you will see the narrowness of your views ...

Anonymous said...

Dear Sir,

There are Sabahan and Sarawakian christians working in Peninsula Malaysia and they regularly use "Allah" as a reference for God in their worship. English, Mandarin, Tamil language churches almost never uses such term.

Just to let your readers know, the Sikhs also uses the term "Allah" in their worship.

http://www.youtube.com/EnvironsEagles#p/u/3/jWXvPicuJEw

So it seems sir, if the court rules that only muslims have the exclusive rights to "Allah", would then Sikhism be considered illegal in Malaysia and thus a banned religion?

All this mess is started by the government when they seized bibles and teaching materials meant for indigenous (Sabahans and Sarawakians) christian folks for their private use. The Hearald is also meant for internal ciculation. Have you or anyone read or seen the Herald sold in the open?

dear Sir, sometimes its not what one eats that make one unclean, its the words that comes out of ones mouth that makes a person unclean.

have a nice day
oedipus

GodNiaseng said...

God utter vulgarity@ mencarut says nikcy aziz,pastor PAS and now The Herald can amalgate with Harakah as one God,muslim kristian ALLAH,THE ONE and ONLY ONE....lETS CONVERT each other in this one Malaysia,One god,one economy,One religion,One king,and all onenabe(wannabe),Hindu also also call Allah,but hiduism is a sacret teaching not religion,so do buddhism...,that means allah is exclusive...not to only malays but all Malaysian....do you buy me..?

Anonymous said...

Hahaha, this is so funny!

In Pakiam's Christianity, a High Court Judge made decision on the name his religion's God could use.

Therefore, hahaha, the High Court is above God in his religion.

I pity his God. hahaha

skilgannon1066 said...

Part A

Warrior XXX and anti whatever have posted positively scintillating arguments worthy of their elevated intellects. Who are we lesser mortals to quibble with their views which they aver as the whole truth and nothing but the truth?

So, if one buys their views:

- "Tuhan" and "Allah" are co-equal in that they are different names for The Almighty (aka God).

- "Allah" is a sub-set of "Tuhan", since by their logic, "Tuhan" is the word used for God - the God of the whole human race - Malays, Indians, Chinese, Japanese, Koreans, Europeans etc and the religions that they profess - Islam, Christianity, Judaism. And since the Muslims (especially the Malaysian Muslims) are a subset of the whole human race, then their claim to the sole and exclusive use of the word "Allah" for God would infer that the word "Tuhan" is the overarching super word for God, inasmuch as "Allah" is the word used by this specific minority.

Since The Almighty (aka God) is omniscient, omnipotent and omnipresent and also all-benevolent and all-loving ("slow to anger, rich in kindness.."), I would humbly think that He would not in the least be bothered by how the human race addresses Him.

Which is why I humbly believe that if The Almighty (aka God) has a sense of humour (which I believe He has), he would be both be amused and taken aback by this kerfuffle over how He should be addressed. Or, maybe, a tad annoyed (the "slow to anger" bit).

skilgannon1066 said...

Part B

Delving into the words of "Negaraku" - the Malaysian National Anthem - one finds the following:

"Rahmat bahagia, Tuhan kurniakan" (which translates as "Blessings of happiness, may God grant")

So, all Malaysians, regardless of race or religion, utter the word "Tuhan" when they sing the National Anthem.

The Rukunegara - the National Pledge, which was formulated after the May 13 incidents - contains, among others, the following phrase:

"Kepercayaan kepada Allah" (which translates as "Belief in Allah).

The Rukunegara is a pledge said by all Malaysians, regardless of race or religion.

The National Anthem, sung by all Malaysians, uses the word "Tuhan". The Rukunegara, said by all Malaysians, uses the word "Allah". Are these words a common denominator for all Malaysians, and in their context, interchangeable, with the same meaning?

Btw, the Johor State Anthem contains the words:

"Allah peliharakan Sultan...
Allah berkati Johor
Allah selamatkan Sultan"

which are proudly sung by all Johoreans, regardless of race or religion.

So, is it "Tuhan" or "Allah"?

skilgannon1066 said...

Part C

It is entirely possible that this case could go all the way up to the Federal Court for a decision.

It would be fascinating to see the expert witnesses called by parties in this case. The expert witnesses could include renowned Islamic and Quranic scholars, both Asian and European.

It is quite possible that the Roman Catholic Church, were it to call upon it's worldwide network of resources, libraries, researchers and experts could posit some formidable arguments. As too could those who insist that use of the word "Allah" is the sole and exclusive prerogative of Muslims, and who have access to an equally wide-ranging amount of expertise.

I can see whole Ph.D. theses springing out of this issue! And researchers flocking to Malaysia to monitor the arguments in the courts.

ah pong said...

PERWIRA;

oh good! today i'm going to GIANT and worship BOH...

but then again we can also worship BOHSIA... there are some who are 3in one.

Anonymous said...

Abdi Allah 12.47,,,sekarang mereka (kononnya ahli kitab) sedang berlaku zalim terhadap orang2 Islam bukan saja diMalaysia tetapi di seluruh dunia. Sudah terang lagi bersuloh, apa yang niat yang tersirat dan tersurat, tujuan sebenar mereka ingin 'share' perkataan Allah. Khalifah2 Allah, jangan lah dikau butakan matamu yang Allah berikan. Jadilah khalifah2 yang jati, memang terang2 orang muslim ditindas diMalaysia semata2 nak 'please' mereka. Mereka sudah keliru dengan agama mereka dan mereka nak kelirukan pengikut2 lain pula.
ml

asimo_romzi said...

malaysia is belong to malay's..even you're in western country like US.They also wont accept you,it because you're asian or black,and not white people like them,.they all are racist..If you want to work with Chinese company,they preferred chinese oral and written as 1 of the requirement ,so they are racist.In singapore alone they not allowed malay's or muslim community at the first place,because singapore belongs to Chinese..is it make sense.so dont say anything YOU OUTSIDER...How about the "others" you think they not racist like i do??depends on they perception.

Lets get back to topic:

Allah is not the "God of Christianity" and this is the plain true beyond doubt.Allah may be the "arabic" word for God.Calling of God with the name "Allah" dated to pre Islam (before Islam) in the Arabian Desert and continued to use even after Islam and the term "Allah" is not belongs sole to Islam.

However the concept of Islamic "Allah" and concept of Christianity "Allah" is not
the same one and have differrent ideology and meanings.

Of course the Malays which have shallow understanding of their religion will get confused if the term "Allah" is used by Christianity in Malaysia to indentify the God of Almighty.That is the reason(s) why
the BN UMNO lead authority banned the term "Allah"usage in Malays version Bible of Christianinty.

skilgannon1066 said...

asimo_romzi

Oh, puhleese, don't display your ignorance regarding the state of Malay-Muslim Singaporeans.

For starters, you might want to Google for "Majlis Ugama Islam Singapura" or MUIS and count just how many mosques there are in Singapore.

Then go look for the latest figures for Singapore's population and see the number of Malays therein.

Now do a quick calculation: number of mosques in Singapore divided by the number of Malays in Singapore.

Then, tell me - is Islam alive and well in Singapore???

Don't be shy, lah - share your findings with the rest of us!

Nzain said...

Skill, when Warrior and Anti calls you an idiot you don't believe them, you go into a hissy fit and kick up a big fuss. But you are an idiot. Big time.
It's Kepercayaan kepada TUHAN. Not Allah.
So back to your question. Is it Tuhan or Allah?

tokaim said...

Tok aim

Mungkinkah disebabkan Bible Indonesia mempunyai perkataan Allah inilah yang menyebabkan Muslim dan Kristian di Indonesia boleh berkahwin tanpa menukar agama kepada agama Islam. Kemudiannya anak-anak apabila cukup umur boleh memilih secara bebas agama apa yang mereka ingin anuti. Adakah begini yang kita mahukan untuk generasi Malaysia yang akan datang?! Fikirkanlah wahai umat Islam. Semua propaganda kafir ini adalah untuk menjatuhkan umat Islam. Layarilah www.wakeupproject.com untuk menyedarkan kita berkenaan agenda zionis dan kafir

Anonymous said...

Skilly++13,

....So, is it "Tuhan" or "Allah"?

See, we aloso have one very confused fella here...

RukunNegara pun tak tau! And of 'cos, all Sultans IN MALAYSIA, not only from Johore, are Muslims..

You have to read the Quran to understand what "ALLAH" means to Muslims worldwide.

Or, probably go here; maybe you will understand better;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dhwdEtO5fJE

Asma Allah

I hope 2010 will make you into a better person.. learn to read the Quran first OK..

PERWIRA

Anonymous said...

Nampak nye skilgannon ni bukan warga Malaysia kot. Takkan tak tahu rukun negara. Kalau begitu lah, dia ni tak ada hak nak bersuara pasal apa-apa yang berlaku di Malaysia.
Ooooohhh patut ler ber ia-ia sangat nak mempertahankan negara Pura-pura di selatan tu. Pandai konon. Piiiiiidah!

AgnostikA said...

view to a kill, and dogs are barking ...

http://www.scribd.com/doc/27367056/The-Dogs-Are-Barking-in-Malaysia