Selangor. Pop: 4-plus million.Malays 2.5 millionThese numbers are taken from this story (Hindraf an extremist group, 8 Dec) which Bernama based on Khir Toyo's interview on RTM last night. The story did not say how many churches, gurdwaras and other houses of other faiths there are in Selangor. I missed the programme so I have no way of telling if the Selangor MB mentioned the other numbers. But do your math and draw your own conclusions based on the numbers, if they are correct.
Mosques 98, suraus 1,000 [Correction 2.30pm, 9/12: I've been told the figure cited by Khir Toyo last night was 358 mosques, not 98. I have informed Bernama of the error. My apologies.]
Chinese 1.3 millioin
Buddhist temples 1,015
Hindu temples 810
Meanwhile, more Umno leaders are clamouring for tough action (read ISA) on P. Uthayakumar and the other Hindraf leaders. Read the posting by Big Dog here. Even the mild-mannered Mukhriz Mahathir is associating Hindraf with "high treason"!
I still say there's no place under the Malaysian sun for the ISA. No more. The ISA has been abused too many times before. The government has made too many mistakes with it in the past.
Sunday, December 09, 2007
Mosques and temples in Malaysia
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ISA against hindraf??
Classic umno’s protocol – when you can't beat em .. put them in jail and shut them up for good.
As much as umno thinks that hindraf leaders have over stepped their rights as malaysian they(umno) should prove to the hindraf leaders that they were wrong. That’s the humane ways.
But of course how could they when they are all a bunch of morons (the keris man, close one eye idiot, AG and EC ad oh the sitting pretty cj and etc.) – basking in the glory of crap.
Make us a believer, umno – show us the proofs hindrafs allegations were wrong?
Ratio are illusions!!ReplyDelete
Area, location and values, key considerations.
Are they in proportion with population?
Source of funding long term calculation.
Build with regulations
much differ from donations!
Built with heritage through generations.
For spiritual sessions
not for political lessons!
A temple brings in spirit and soul
with small business to keep employment soar.
How many kids, women and aged to hold?
There are much history and culture to be told?
How many tribes for Indian and Chinese?
so ingredients much more folds!!
Counting 1000s of years to mold!
A temple hold not only God
Many HUMAN with heart purified to be so.
Not appointed by God
or self-announcing as God!
No the power He or She hold
but the heart He or She show!
Seeing the outside is easy
understanding the inside is fancy!
Big is what they mean
and not big in what they look!
To the Heart they talk
and with the soul they walk!
No loudspeaker to work!!
I think the figures are quite realistic. In my place our 4,000 chinese have 2 buddhist temples and 2 churches, 3,000 malays have 2 mosques and 4 suraus and 800 indians have 3 hindu temples. Chinese own 95% of wealth and properties, indians 3% and malay 2%. Oh... please... with NEP and government subsidies malays still struggle to make ends meet. Hello kawan, try to live in the philippines, thailand or indonesia, you can't even keep your ethnic names, mother-tongues and national-type schools.ReplyDelete
What about Taoist temples? There are a lot of Taoist temples but not that many Buddhist temples in Malaysia. I don't think I agree with the statistics.ReplyDelete
I agree with you ROcky. Just chop of the dickens of Hindraf masterminds and leaders.ReplyDelete
Without that vital facility, life is not worth the living and they'll submit themselves to any imprisonment with or without trial.
I agree with Mukhriz too. Hindraf has done high treson.
Rocky, this is a difficult one. I for one will never vote or associate myself with any organisation with a racist agenda, be it UMNO or Hindraf. I do appreciate your fair blog. The other side of the coin, can be gotten from the three interviews of Uthayakumar:ReplyDelete
The tough question is that if just because one says that he/she isn't racist does that make them not? UMNO have been telling us for years that they aren't racist but everyone in their right mind knows they are.
I'm starting to think that this has nothing to do with the oppressed but EVERYTHING to do with hatred and bigotry. Looking at the responses and talking to many Hindus, all I can see and feel coming from them is pure, rabid hatred for Islam and all they can see is one temple (speaking rhetorically) being destroyed. I think this Hindraf movement has been quietly sowing distrust and fuelling hatred against Islam (for whatever agenda) amongst the downtrodden and marginalized for a while now.
The Hindraf stalwarts can only see THEIR problems, THEIR temples, associate all government action against illegal temples as a MUSLIM against Hindu thing and that all other races are well off except for them. Talking to them is useless, because they have shut off their ears and eyes, which easily happens when someone is incited and brainwashed into anger and hatred.
I'm sad actually, that I don't go to the Hindu shop which serves the best tosai in Melawati anymore since all this surfaced, because I now see the owners (who are devout Hindus with deities all over the shop, whom I used to greet with as Auntie/Uncle/Bro), in a different light.
All I can ask myself is, "beneath the smile they give me, do they actually hate/resent this/these Muslim woman/customers who come/s and eat/s here, what do they REALLY think beneath that smile? Have I been misjudging them all this while? Are they going to be the ones who slaughter me and my family (god forbid) as the Serb neighbors did their fellow Muslims who had been their friends for scores of years?
So, I don't go there anymore. I'm also so wary of my guards who are Hindus, who now spend more time sitting in groups and discussing things in hushed tones and serious looks on their faces, and I do know that they are Hindraf supporters to begin with. As vice chair of the residents' association, I wonder about Mr. SXXXXXX, the property manager who is a devout Hindu, whom I joke and talk to regarding the residents' daily problems, who is also a Hindraf stalwart. I wonder if I should tell him that the residents are getting worried and want to terminate the Hindu guards' tenure because they are getting worried about the rumors of arms caches in Batu Caves, and of Hindu mobs planning to go on rampages, and whether their families will be safe at night.
It might sound silly and paranoid, but not far-fetched. I can understand how hatred just blinds people and turns them into monsters and merciless murderers because they no longer see the victims as humans. We have seen it in Bosnia, in Rwanda,in Nazi Germany, in Palestine, in Israel, in Iraq, everywhere.
I do not think that Uthaya and the other leaders care about the marginalization of the Hindu poor...its more about hatred and bigotry against Malay Muslims and Islam in general.
I really think that Pak Lah has to act now, as they are taking advantage of his weak administration and the seriously lacking and outnumbered police force and the seemingly total lack pf preparation to meet any eventuality.
To tell you the truth, Rocky...my mum has seen the brutality of the fanatic Hindus during the Partition, the wanton murder of her friends and teachers and neighbors with her own eyes, and the horror of May 13 when she was living in KL as a kid...and I definitely don't want my kids to experience something like that.
The government needs to flex its muscle and ensure the safety of all Malaysians, and it also needs to address the issues which affect all the races in a fair and just manner, to avoid the resentment and bitterness of the masses being used by the unscrupulous leaders with their own personal agenda and zealotry.
Is ALL this going to help the Hindus or blind others further to their legitimate problems?
In other words..I'm VERY afraid for my children. First we have the murderers, robbers and rapists targeting kids of all races,...now we have the Hindu mob scenarios and all sorts of rumors to contend with.
GIVE US MOTHERS A BLOODY BREAK.
still think that concern party that hindraf trying to make and shout still does not fully undertand the whole picture...instead of just stating figures how many mosques/temples why just everybody sit down all together and talk rationally...simply saying kalau takede angin masakan pokok boleh bergoyang...now it's as if one party is shouting A and another party is shouting Z...so the whole picture just makes ppl misinterpret and misconcept of the whole scenario....ReplyDelete
when it comes to al-maunah or any Muslim perceived to be taking up arms, the govt is swift to take action, and try them for treason and shove them in ISA hell...BUT WHY ISN'T THE GOVT ACTING IN THIS BLATANT ACT OF TREASON AND INCITEMENT??? MANA PERGI BOLA2 DEPA???ReplyDelete
Umno is to blame as much as the Hindu racists, and I too would like to shove Hishamuddin and the hysterical keris wielding umnoputra mob into ISA hell to for giving other races amno to create more shit in our already rotting system. So shove the buggers in together with Uthaya and the other damn ultras making life miserable for all of us.
ISA could be relevant as a preemptive measure. Sort of like in the "Minority Report" movie.ReplyDelete
Currently the police jurisdiction is for (I believe) 18 days. Subsequent to that it is the authority of the Home Affairs Minister for further detention.
This power must be removed and empowered to judges to ensure no abuses of ISA for political means.
Secondly the detention must not be indefinite as in the case of BSA Tahir, who looks likely to permanently languish in jail throughout Pak Lah's Premiership to protect his son Kamaluddin. BSA Tahir should have faced trail by now.
No one should be single handedly empowered to make any decision to indefinitely hold someone and curtail thir freedom without trail. It must have due processs where many is made responsible for the decision and each is liable for civil action for their decision.
The rule must be such that no one is free from the prospect of ISA. As it is Pak Lah, SIL and family is free from the application of ISA despite believed to be hand in glove with foreign power to implement policies detrimental to national interest and security.
The system must provide for someone or entity to have authority to decide and empowered to apply the ISA on the Home Minsiter/PM and even Royalties.
ISA is fine but must be based on proofs. Mana ada Komunis lagi sikalang?
First of all, I do not believe at the published numbers. Does anyone believe they were only 4K participants from the Nov 10th Rally? This was what the government telling the world.ReplyDelete
Among the 1015 and 81o temples, how many of them are community based? Do they include roadside ‘Datuk Kong” and makeshift kuils? How about individual operated temples using their homes?
Unlike Malay, government builds them and their sizes are enormous. How many Chinese and Indian temples are built and funded by the government?
Numbers can be misleading especially they come from bureaucrats. For fair and accurate reporting, the government should have calculated in term of square footage.
1 surau/masjid serve Muslim popn of 2,277ReplyDelete
1 Buddhist temple for 1,281 Buddhist.
1 Hindu temple for 790 HIndus.
Now I know what happened to all the odd looking big trees and why our green disappeared. Hehehe ...
It was converted into temples.
Surprisingly after the tree no longer exist, the shrine has grown into a big temple. Without the tree, why should the temple continue to exist?
Perhasp I shouldn't be questioning how another religion practise their faith. The point here is that this does not include the various shrines found harphazardly just about any where.
Building of shrines should be confined to private area. It is unfair and insensitive to the Muslims.
Freedom of religion is safeguarded in the constitution but harmony and Muslim sensitivity as practitioner of the religion of the Federation must be of foremost consideration. Thats in the Constitution.
Good expose here, lets get down to basic than using international media to perpetuate lies and threaten arm struggle.
P/S wonder what the figures are when taking into account illegal temples of Hindraf.
353 Masjid, 1621 surauReplyDelete
Racists, I am fed up of this word. If only the umnoputras can stop using it and practicing it. oh sorry!! when they bring it up its national issue. poodah. As for Mukhriz mild mannered or not still politician meh and plays the game. Finally on Khir Toyol, cannnot believe a word he says. Come on my Malaysian brothers and sisters, lets remain in solidarity and not be exploited by these politikus(es). There is more work to be done it is obvious but there remains hope as long as we are rational.ReplyDelete
I agree with Selangor MBs statistics. I live in a neighbourhood where there is only one mosque (no other suraus) but there is at least six churchers. The mosque was built purely on private funding and public donation (no Govt assistance).
Shows how lenient and tolerant the local authorities are.
I agree with Hantutelur. Some of our close neighbours made ethnic citizens from other origin to change their names, systematically discouraged the use of their mother tongue and totally disallowed vernacular schools.
UMNO is a nationalists political party. It fought and look after the interests of the majority of this country, who are the indigenous people. Racism is totally different.
Nationalism is the fundamental drive for achieving the independence of this country.
The proofs of HINDRAF is wrong is all there. Its either one want to see it or not. I have written about it too, few days ago.
You shuold go holiday and be sincere to yourself.ReplyDelete
Of lately, you have gone fictional.
The mosques, churches, templesReplyDelete
Why quote the numbers?
Aren’t they are the places of worship?
Bringing the children to The Lord?
Everything should be above board
Why give money to some and not others?
The government divides so are the religious benefits
Give them religion less crimes will be had
Less greed in the minds
Knowing salvation isn’t for them
People need places of worships
To tell The Almighty what they need
The government should be tolerant
Allowing places where there is a seed
Glory is to those who walk with God
In His place paradise freely lives
But have we in it in our hearts and souls?
Like brothers and sisters
Sharing our common destiny
We are on earth for a reason
Be the children of God in heavens
But do your math and draw your own conclusions based on the numbers, if they are correct.ReplyDelete
Maybe,yeah, i should say you were fair afterall to include the words.. "if they are correct" as above.
Nonetheless, another factor which has been missed by many is that those affected "claim" a good level of "high handedness and no respect displayed" during each demolition exercise whether temples illegal or not .Factors like these provoke emotions which we may be seeing in certain people now under the watch of the authorities.
Even we Malaysians cannot accept this when observed in similar/parallel instances in in other countries ??
Most of the temples and kuils have capacities less than most of the suraus. In other words each of these temples and kuils contain less worshippers than a surau.ReplyDelete
I would suggest that after getting this perspective right, only only do the arithmatics.
what? no stat on church?ReplyDelete
they must be hiding something.
must organise walk and carry pope picture and demand for foreign intervention then.
I think the ratio of Buddhist temple can be realistic. Reason is this. Buddhist temple can be place anywhere at any size.ReplyDelete
However, Hindu temple may be distorted. It is almost 0.8 Hindu Temples to 1 Surau.
I think the small scale suraus in buildings are not included in the calculation. Nevermind that, look around, do you see hindu temple?
Take a drive all around Selangor, do you see Hindu temple often?
Answer is not much.
It's just a figure. Who cares. If this country is really giving freedom of religion, they should even bother to put this ratio out to sensationalize the fact that Hindu Temple to be taken down.
Hantu Telur saidReplyDelete
"In my place our 4,000 CHINESE have 2 buddhist temples and 2 churches"
Hmm,...interesting "fact"! There no Chinese-Taoists in your area????? As a Malaysian I know for a FACT they make up quite a sizeable number in the country.
Are there no INDIAN CHRISTIANS whose festival falls on Dec 25 (quite a number are Catholics) there too? Hmm....
On another note, funny why many, posters included, have this mistaken believe that ALL Indians belong to only relgion?
Numbers don't mean anything. Size does.ReplyDelete
So you can have many SMALL temples but SUPER DUPER Sized mosques. Similarly, with prayer houses and the like. Are we than comparing like with like?
Since there have been many comments about churches having problems setting up places of worship, it is pertinent to have this figure too.
Is your assertion increasingly carrying a racial undertone? Am I am overly sensitive? But some of your commentators seem to respond instinctively with similar overtone. You reproved that Hindraf was extreme but do not agree to the use of ISA for correcting the situation. Is that an option that UMNO and MIC would consider since their credibilities hang on a thin thread? Wouldn't it be more convenient to quote that Hindraf is extreme and legitimise ISA as a necessary evil extention to your assertion. Who was it that quoted "The enemy of my enemy is my friend"? Hindraf is fighting for the same freedom you constantly seek for Malaysians. Tactics may be crude, even absurd, but the Indian community who got involved is your brethens too. IMHO, there is no need for further assertion on Hindraf 'extremism'; seemingly, as our own past mirror reflection dictates, minority groupies who are not economical viable is f--ked anyway. Just let them decompose naturely and claim the pretension to heroism for noble causes. w9ReplyDelete
1,000 over Buddhist temples and 810 Hindu temples? How come they are not visible?ReplyDelete
What we see are the huge, magnificent mosques everywhere.
If Khir Toyo like to quote figures, then perhaps as the head of a "developed state", can he supply figures as to how much was spent by the State government in building places of worship for all religions given that the government support and encourage all religions?
Rocky, this got me thinking. With the number of surau, mosque, churches, temple etc in Malaysia and yet the crime rate increasing too. The role of our religious homes fail miseribly as we still return home and continue beating our wives, rape our children, cheats on husband, abuse our maid and animal etc. If only human being really truly understand the meaning of ' your body is your temple', then probably we all can stop this mad notion competition on who have the most mosques, temple, church.ReplyDelete
Peace and Love
after 50 years of independant, these politicians still divide the nation/ppls using religious issues...ReplyDelete
but for some simple folks, we rather believe...
"When I do good, I feel good; when I do bad, I feel bad. That's my religion". - Lincoln
"Lighthouses are more helpful than places of worship".
I've seen so many blog regular readers and commentators (be it be pro or anti govt)accusing others (esuch Umno, Hindraf, or whoever) being racist but have you asked yourself that are we not being racists ourselves??? Be realistic abt it.. life is unfair, give me one country in this world is not racist or discriminate. Wake up guys! In USA, the blacks feel they are also being suppressed by their govt or white ppl. Singapore, even harder to fine a non-chinese in top position though they are qualified or better than chinese. In Australia, USA or most of the countries claimed to be fair and democratic,let me tell you guys, as long as you are black or yellow skin, even you are the 3rd or 4th generation, and carry their citizenship (still being called chinese American,or Korean American or Black) and still being treated as 2nd class citizen. And this topic in USA, is still hot and catagorised as sensitive issue..
May be the members of Hindraf, should pay a visit to India and you will thank god that your great grandfather migrated to Malaysia as I am appreciate Malaysia every day (after my visit recently )for giving me a decent life as long as I work hard, I know that I can earn a good living.
Tell me which party is not racist? It is easy to say them to claim that they are not racist, lets us wait until the power in it their hand, you will see everyone of them will focus on their race only..DAP, MCA/GERAKAN/MIC or UMNO/PAS not racist? Keadilan? I dont even want to consider it as they are chameleon..
SO guys.. it's time to realise that we human like to blame on others but ourselves for the failure and our feeling can easily point to our race, skin colour or blah blah. For once, stop blaming the whole world for our own failure but look and access ourselves and think why some ppl can be successful in the same so called "racist country". The racism can be wipe off from our future generation only if we start it from us.
So guys, work hard and strive better life for our future to live in peaceful ground.
We should fight for ending the corruption,uplift the life of the poor & unfortunate and be a caring society without bragging into the political parties cos none of them are sincere and all of them are racist..
Rocky's bru.. continue your virtue fight.. we are behind you.
Having read so many views from the faces that patronize your blog, I am now inclined to say my piece.
Its all about making things simple, going back to the good old days where we could acknowledge each other as different and yet come together to assist each other when any one is disturbed/affected.
Those folks who are hell bent on justifying their decisions imposed on the helpless, should take a leaf from the owners of Mid Valley, right in the heart of Kuala Lumpur.
How many of you folks notice a beautifully built Hindu temple right in the midst of this sprawling commercial complex that is now expanding day by day?
How did the temple come about?
Anyone willing to discuss and admit?
A Malaysian Chinese private developer can make a decision and had nothing to lose, but gain the respect and gratitude from the Hindus who patronise the temple.
Go, investigate how much money was put forth by the temple committee to build the temple and you will get startling information.
And is anyone now going to pressure the owners of Mid Valley to co-operate with DBKL to demolish the temple? I doubt!
Thats Malaysia Boleh!
Not flaunting nor going into rhetorics about how a temple was re-built, yes - rebuilt.
And the Hindus who run the premise now have educated themselves to keep the premise very clean, as its now their responsibility to ensure the place of worship blends well with the modern structures around it.
So what you have now is a perfect harmony of place of worship (which does not affect the operations of Mid Valley) amidst a busy business centre.
And do we not see how business is growing well in Mid Valley (at least for the developers!)?
Nowadays, there is this stupid behaviour/reasoning, yes - stupid indeed, which seems to go along the lines of 'you do not a need a place of worship in this place as the number of people of this faith are not in great numbers'.
And then there is also another reasoning which says, the structure is built:
a. Without approval form the authorities
b. On land not gazetted for places of worship
c. In a very offending manner for the believers of other faiths
Want to know how this ruling is stupid?
Look at Batu Caves.
Anyone cares to check the history of this temple?
When did the Hindus start having a place fo worship there?
Was it with approval from the then government of the day?
Were there many Hindus around that area that time? For that matter now...are they outnumbering the Malaysians of other faiths around that area?
How did it now become a tourist attraction?
What did the government later, much later, do for this place of worship?
A private developer can make provisions to legalise the existence of a temple that had modest beginnings without proper approvals.
A natural limestone formation used for worship, without any approvals from any government authority can be gazetted as a tourist attraction subsequently and given all the necessary official approvals.
But the same goodwill and understanding does not seem to happen in some other cases - be it suraus, temples or other places of worships.
Just after independence when the authorities were hell-bent to ensure our plantations and tin mines were rightfully in the hands of 'Malaysians', they went about lobbying for it in many ways and were successful. Guthries, Sime Darby and a number of other private enterprises owned/operated by foreigners were taken over by 'Malaysian' owners.
Temples, suraus, schools on such lands existed before the takeover.
But when it came to redevelopment of such lands (from agriculture to commercial/housing), these premises that played a great role in nurturing the priciples of Rukun Negara (which was only formalised much later than these schools and places of worship) were not given due attention like what happended in Mid-Valley or Batu Caves.
The new owners (Sime Darby, Guthries, other private developers, state governments) always seem to have other ideas.
Hence, the end of places of worships, closing down of schools -with the reasoning that there is no 'critical mass' to justify the continued existence of such structures nor legalise their existence.
The authorities seem to take a short cut to bull doze their way in enforcing court orders of state government exco decisions and incur the wrath of the simple folks who have been living in harmony for many years.
I ask, can these new land owners not do their bit for the continued existence of these places of worship and schools by setting aside some part of their profits for this purpose?
Can that not be their Corporate Social Responsibility for ensuring peace and stability in this country?
Why leave it to those politicians who do very little most of the time, but always claim the credit for bringing about the muhibbah spirit amongst the simple Malaysians?
(Nowadays its so fashionable for CSR to be only linked to environment, caring for one or two needy communities in isolated parts of Malaysia, protecting animals from going extinct etc.)
The Menteri Besar of Selangor now only claims that he too slept in temples! What a shame!! He is a real politician indeed.
How come you were not there when the temples were being torn down?
How come he could not get his ex-co to make decisions on such structures that would nurture more peace and harmony?
How come the local authorities are forced to 'ikut perintah' to demolish structures of this kind which are actually identities to showcase our original harmonious beginnings in simple surroundings?
The Hindarf folks are trying to bring to the attention to all about the unfair methods now being applied in such situations.
What other avenues are available for them?
a. Police reports?
b. Petitions to the government?
c. Discussions with authorities?
Who says they did not do and ask for all these?
We should ask, how many of these were actually handled in an appropriate manner by those who are in power?
Even Rocky's report to the Elections Commission about how his name has been abused in the voter's regsiter has not had a proper handling. And Rocky - you are a well known blogger. If that can happen to you in this system, you think the affected ones that the Hindraf is championing for will get justice done?
And why must it be the politicians who should get involved in such matters?
Why can these guys in authority follow the MidValley example?
The obvious question we can ask is 'How come there seems to be legislation to ensure new Mosques or Suraus are a vital aspect of any redevelopment plan - thrust on the developers - but also concurrent behaviour by the authorities to deliberate on ways and means to ensure no or vey little redevelopment assistance is given to existing temples?'
Oh, by the way, our folks in power not only demolish places of worship - but also structures like the airport in Subang that was rebuilt twice with tax payers money. They even wanted to do that to Merdeka Stadium, Stadium Negara, Victoria Instituion, but so far things are OK.
But pity other schools like St Marys, Bukit Bintang Girls School -may be they could not take it as these places (that were built before these fellows were born) had a very small 'cross' or something to the effect that these buggers could see from across many miles, but not the outstanding Malaysians of all races that these institutions produced!
Do you have any answers Rocky?
beeranyone, 12:03 pm. Very well said, you got it 100% correct.ReplyDelete
I'll drink to your philosophy.
All religions are, is essence, exactly the same, and human beings are all the same race, 'the human race' so why all the fuss.
bigdogdotcom, you saidReplyDelete
"UMNO is a nationalists political party. It fought and look after the interests of the majority of this country, who are the indigenous people. Racism is totally different."
"Nationalism is the fundamental drive for achieving the independence of this country."
What rubbish you wrote.
1. The only indigenous people of Malaysia are the aboriginal people (Orang Asli and the Native Peoples of Borneo)
The Malay (who are a mixed group with roots elsewhere in SE Asia, South Asia, Middle East and elsewhere) along with the Chinese, the Indians and all the others are immigrants.
Read history (the real version) and you will understand and learn the truth.
Malaysia already has independence, thus going by your argument UMNO serves no purpose now.
I agree fully with that.
Apa-apa pun, we need to stop talking and TAKE ACTION!!!
Current approach is creating racial tension and unnecessary headace to all of us. Just take what ever necessary action to stop all this nonsense.
Anonymous 11:34 AM said...ReplyDelete
Hmm,...interesting "fact"! There no Chinese-Taoists in your area????? As a Malaysian I know for a FACT they make up quite a sizeable number in the country.
Must be Taoists not Buddhists. I don't know, to me all of them are the same.
Sir you are entitled to your views.ReplyDelete
The Hindraf guy has also done this report. But who cares?
After all it is not a report by someone from the ruling party.
Ever noticed how such reports by those in the ruling party are quickly investigated whereas there is no squeak by the police on such reports like the one stated below?
So why not you address this basic question - how come police reports by those in power are investigated and acted upon but not those done by the ones who do not belong to the ruling party?
Lets see if you have the guts to show yourself as a fair Malaysian, mindful of the needs and despair of Malaysians of all ethnic origins and political affiliations.
Police report by P. Uthayakumar 8-12-07 (against Prime Minister, Law Minister, Attorney General, Inspector General of Police.
Police Report by myself P. Uthayakumar against (1) Malaysian Prime Minister Badawi and UMNO Leaders (2) Law Minister Nazri, (3) Attorney General Gani Patail, (4) Inspector General of Police Musa Hassan and (5) the UMNO controlled print and electronic media namely The News Strait Times, The Star, Malay Mail, Utusan Malaysia, Berita Harian, TV3, RTM 1 and 2, NTV 7 and Astro etc for making false, malicious, seditious, criminally defamatory, racially inciting and inflammatory statements and/or publishing and/or broadcasting and/or causing to be published and/or broadcasted and/or causing the same to be broadcasted that Hindraf has links with LTTE, terrorist groups and supports violence.
Over the last three (3) weeks the UMNO controlled Malaysian Government and authorities have been going on a smear campaign and/or Hindraf bashing sessions using their aforesaid print and electronic media and on a headlines basis almost every day.
The statements published and/or broadcasted and/or caused to be published and/or broadcasted that I and/or the Hindu Rights Action Force (Hindraf) have links with terrorist organizations, and/or supports violence, Nazri’s statement that “this was from statements of Hindraf leaders who went overseas to garner support that they would meet LTTE leaders” (“Links with Tamil Tigers and India’s RSS, says Nazri,” The Star 8-12-2007 page N10) and Gani Patail’s statement that “The AG had on Wednesday told the court that he had reports Hindraf members had connections with the LTTE” (“Hindraf has links with Tigers” (New Straits Times 8-12-2007 Page 6 (based on an alleged police report lodged by a member of the public which I now say is a false police report. Please investigate and let me know within 48 hours from the date and time herein) is false, malicious, seditious, criminally defamatory racially inciting and inflammatory.
This is a desperate attempt by UMNO and the Malaysian authorities to sidetrack and/or divert from the real issues Hindraf is championing that is the racism, marginalisation and permanent colonialisation of the ethnic minority Indians in Malaysia by the UMNO controlled Malaysian government for the past 50 years. This is especially so after 25-11-2007 whereafter Hindraf enjoys the support of at least 95% of the 2 million Indians in Malaysia and also has the support and sympathy of foreign governments, NGOs and the media.
This latest statement is also to falsely and maliciously build up a case against me and Hindraf leaders to detain me and other Hindraf leaders without trial under the draconian Internal Security Act and/or other laws and deny me and the others bail and lock us up and punish us even before we are being found guilty in a Court of Law as was done to the 31 peaceful assemblers and hindu devotees praying at Batu Caves by the Shah Alam Sessions Court on 6th December 2007.
The above is also a political ploy as the Malaysian general elections are around the corner. Hindraf and their members are victimized persecuted, maliciously and racially prosecuted to show to especially the 60% malay muslim majority that the Indians have been punished for their alleged “demonstration” on 25-11-07.
The News Straits Times in particular on the 7th and 8th of December maliciously did not publish the whole truth ie “Waytha Moorthy’s brother Uthayakumar had also told The New Paper in Singapore that he could not rule our violence if the demands of the Indian community were not met “(New Straits Time dated 8-12-07 page 6)
What was maliciously deliberately and intentionally not published was that I and Hindraf have always maintained that we are committed and that we would only persue our struggle through legal and peaceful means following Ghandi’s peaceful and non violent “ahiesma” struggle.
When asked by The New Paper reporter I expressed fears and concerns that the uneducated Indian masses who may not know of other avenues and having pushed to the wall may resort to violence which was more correctly reported in The Star on 7-12-07 but asserted once again that Hindraf on its part was committed to a legal and peaceful struggle. But this whole truth was never published by the New Straits Times.
I hereby challenge the Prime Minister, Law Minister, Attorney General and the Inspector General of Police to within 24 hours to produce to me, the local and foreign print and electronic media at a press conference the alleged hard evidence of Hindraf’s link to terrorism and violence failing which I and Hindraf shall presume that the alleged evidence does not exist.
I also challenge the aforesaid individuals to investigate and make public the real culprits who attacked and killed the 5 Indians and injured 100 over others in the Kg Medan racial attacks tragedy from 8-3-01 to 22-3-01.
Also investigate the 1,000 over police reports against the various UMNO leaders and Malaysian authorities for the shoot to kill of hundreds of suspects and the mysterious deaths of hundreds in police custody (60% estimated to be Indians who only from 8% of the population) and hundreds of Indian “suspects unlawfully arrested, detained, beaten-up and tortured, hundreds of hindu temples demolished at the rate of one hindu temple in every three weeks and scores of hindu temples forced to relocate next to sewerage tanks.
Kindly also investigate the truth of my 1,000 over letters, memorandums, appeals protest notes scores of Civil Suits etc to the Prime Minister Ministers, Attorney General, Inspector General of Police, Chief Ministers and the other Malaysian authorities about the racism, marginalization and permanent colonialism of the Indians in Malaysia which only proves Hindraf’s track record of legal and peaceful struggle and Hindraf being no where near terrorism and/or violence. (Published in www.policewatchmalaysia.com)
I fear for me and my family’s safety and ask for 24 hours police protection.
Uthayakumar a/l Ponnusamy
well, well what can I say?ReplyDelete
extremism breeds extremism; and the malays should have thought hard about this before allowing their religion to be dicked around with by politicians on both sides of the divide.
on that same token, the hindus should also now mobilize to keep their own religious lunatics in check.
I feel safe in Malaysia becauce of the existence, presence and the ready availabality of ISA.Today I am 60 yrs old. I've never been once sceptical, wooried and afraid of ISA. Should I continue to live for another 30-40 yrs, I am dead confident that I'll never be retained of detained under ISA. Reason; I can understand how the simple laws operate. ISA simply meant for people with dectructiveness, criminality and those who create trouble.ReplyDelete
Dear Rocky, even if the statistic was true and accurate, one must understand the usual "Chinese temples" (be it Buddhist or Taorist, since most of the people in our country don't really appreciate the difference) and Indian temples are really small in size, some were run from home and some are actually under a shady tree. In their usual unfair manner, The authority must have taken this kind of worship places as temples per se. I don't know but I wish to know if the mosques and suraus are funded by tax payers money? The temples are not, for sure.ReplyDelete
Hmm according to Tekhsin Mukhtar she does not go to the best Thosai shop in Melawati anymore because of this Hindraf thing and their Hindus. You see I have a problem with that. The first problem is the fact that there is only one Hindu Thosai shop in Melawati and their thosai sucks! Seriously the became the best banana leaf restaurant in Melawati is becausethey are the only one banana leaf restaurant in melawati. Feel free to organize a march to protest why there is only one banana leaf restaurant here and blame it on Umno and NEP. Don't worry you're not being racist, only malays who support umno are racist, Feel free to use words like ethnic cleansing and apartheid.ReplyDelete
However not eating at a banana leaf restaurant because of Hindraf and being suspicious because they're hindus is abit over the edge for me. That does not make sense, not all indians join Hindraf and most of the people who join in the rally don't even know about the memorandum.
I don't think sentencing the whole community just because the action of some is not justified, in fact it's rather shallow and narrow kind of point of view. The last time I pass by that restaurant there were no Hindraf flags flying around.
hahahaha, after accusing the govt and police of ethnic cleansing, genocide etc...Uthaya now seeks police protection...ReplyDelete
Like I said before, the only solution to all this rising racist sentiments is interracial fucking.ReplyDelete
You heard me. Interracial fucking.
You can never totally hate the race of the person whom you just fucked.
For example, I love Thais, Kiwis, Chinese, Malays, Kadazans, Kayans, Caucasians, East Europeans, South Americans, Kampucheans, the Portuguese, Myanmarese, and even the Kelantanese.
So, instead of interfaith dialogues, we should be doing interfaith orgies.
I volunteer to organize these orgies. At the cost of just one temple.
first i don't trust the stats. Does it include the datuk Kongs? They use which ever stats that favour them. can they share the raw data and lets us counter check them?ReplyDelete
anyway how many new temples have been build and are being build in the last 10 years.
I seriously agreed with your solution, though not in so crude term. Inter-racial marriage is a good way to solve this ridiculous inter-racial problems.
Dear Rocky, the comment reactions in your blogs are now starting to look like they've been infiltrated by UMNO lackies. As much as I do not agree with Hindraf, I think that reporting and interpretation has to be fair. Hindraf has never mentioned any hatred for Islam, so implying that is leading to falsehood, a crime by many of your posters here. Najib and the lot are now linking the group to the LTTE. On what basis? Nobody in their right mind believes that it is true. And in the end the poorest of the poorest continues to suffer.ReplyDelete
Perhaps you can try to mobilise a new non-racial, non-corrupt based movement to help the poor. Let's get rid of racialists organisations like UMNO, MIC, MCA and Hindraf once and for all. As I've said before, let's put the last 50 years of failures aside and look forward to the next 50. I can help with donations.
Sinatra...what i meant was...it made me paranoid, not sentencing all Hindus..just makes me wary...what with all the rumors flying around, not knowing which is spin and which is the truth...I think Hindraf put that sentence on all the Hindus' heads themselves...ReplyDelete
ya...true....only one banana leaf restaurant there..what to do..can't get the Indian "tendency for drama and exaggeration" gene out of my blood...
the truth and the truth 1306pmReplyDelete
agree...sometimes ppl are in the constant denial syndrome till they didn't realise...and when things start to happen then it's looking around blame game...privilege will always be privilege
and race problem will never settle...cos each and every one of us belong to all the specific group...all of us are humans no matter which color skin....and GOD created all the different races is to test if we can live side by side peacefully...and it's a TEST...and well do not know if we failed it...the whole problem i think is due to failure in racial integration and understanding...
FYI to all readers:ReplyDelete
India's Prime Minister is a sikh, the president is a muslim and the head of the ruling party is a roman catholic. Not bad for a country that has 900 million Hindu's.
From your tone of your mail, you sound like a racist idiot. Uthaya did not have to prove or sound racist, the fact is I'm an educated Indian live long enough in Malaysia to know the truth. By the way, why are you afraid of the Indians? Have they been attacking you or have you been pushed to the corner like we Indians have been for donkey years? Give me a bloody break. Stop sounding like a 'holier than thou'. Infact you sound more of a Islamic Extremist that would go all out to get what that belongs to you. I bet people like the 'Keris Man' who waved his keris last year shouting like a moron that he will bathe his keris with blood does not scream racist to you? Tell you what, you don't have to be with the Indians, don't have to socialise with them nor eat their damn food. Why don't you just migrate to another country, since you guys are good at telling the non muslims that we should ever since 25/11. You are the racist one. Don't play victim here and make mole out of a mountain. It's just that difficult for some of you guys to accept the truth about how we Indians have been treated for years. UTHAYA ONLY SPOKE THE TRUTH NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH. IF you can't digest that, you must be one of those idiots who have been benefitting all the perks of being a MUSLIM. Yeah I sound racist now, so be it.I'm sick of tired of being nice and good to my Muslim friends when all they think is we are now fighting for a bigger piece of cake. Damn all of you who think that we non muslims have no right to voice out our misery . Malaysia is our country as well , just like any of you. We are just asking to be fair , not abolish the stupid NEP or your stupid priviledges that all of us have been deprieved for years. God is watching all your atrocities, for how long more are you guys are going to kick the poor when they down in their dumps. My prayers aint answered yet, I'm still waiting .
“Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without it, you'd have good people doing good things and evil people doing bad things, but for good people to do bad things, it takes religion.”ReplyDelete
~~~ beer anyone?
Anonymous at 10.28am:ReplyDelete
...sigh...people like you only read into stuff I write what their skewed minds and brains are attuned to...lotih la..think what you want...can't help you...anyone is free to interpret and read into things any which way they choose to...depending on which way their internal radar is skewed...so you can call me/think of me anything you want to believe...
COMMONWEALTH ETHNIC INDIAN PEACE LOVING SUBJECTS IN MALAYSIA PERSECUTED BY GOVERNMENT BACKED ISLAMIC EXTREMIST VIOLENT ARMED TERRORIST WHO LAUNCHED A PRE DAWN VIOLENT ARMED ATTACK AND DESTROYED THE KG JAWA MARIAMAN HINDU TEMPLE AT 4.00 A.M THIS MORNING (15.11.2007).ReplyDelete
APPEAL FOR U.K TO MOVE EMERGENCY U.N RESOLUTION CONDEMNING “ETHNIC CLEANSING” IN MALAYSIA.
Malaysian Indians have been permanently colonialised by the Islamic fundamentalist and Malay chauvinists UMNO led Malaysian government.
"Uthaya spoke the truth and nothing but the truth."
Hishamuddin swing keris and shout hidup melayu.
Apatheid, NEP, Muslim Extremist, idiot malay and whatever.
Satire is perhaps the best way to explain things.. In the words of another anonymous...
I am fedup of living with these Muslim Malays and Bumiputra in apartheid Malaysia. I want to go Australia/UK/USA with appa/amma so i can study in a better local Tamil school and celebrate a 2 days Deepavali Public Holiday. I will propose a compulsory Indian Vice Pres for US/AUS/UK and make Tamil a 3rd language in UN and a 1st language in INDIA.
And when I grow up I want to to build as many Large Hindu Temple anywhere I like, like near Sydney Bridge or under London Bridge..maybe even beside the Statue of Liberty in New York. Bad Bye Malaysia!
I support Interfaith Orgies.
Make love not war.
"I feel safe in Malaysia becauce of the existence, presence and the ready availabality of ISA.Today I am 60 yrs old. I've never been once sceptical, wooried and afraid of ISA. Should I continue to live for another 30-40 yrs, I am dead confident that I'll never be retained of detained under ISA. Reason; I can understand how the simple laws operate. ISA simply meant for people with dectructiveness, criminality and those who create trouble."
Sir, you should start being sceptical and really worried if the ISA is easily invoked just to shut up individuals.
My father was detained for about 5 years under the ISA and he was put in not because he was destructive, a criminal or a troublemaker.
He was not the only one.
He was incarcerated for political reasons although he was not a politician but a newspaper editor.
The ISA was abused as a potent/dangerous/effective tool against individuals deemed a threat to certain powerful politicians because under the ISA, you are detained without trial for up to 60 days.
We wish we knew then what we know now -- that we can challenge his arrest.
So, sir. Have some conscience.
The only "human" comment in this blog is from bro "amir". We should appoint him as our messenger to meet up with Hindraf representatives. Both him and utayakhumar can start the ball rolling by licking each other first... ha ha ha....
Nuraina Samad it is plain that newspaper editor can also wreak destruction - pen is mighter than the sword. So stop objecting for the sake of objectingReplyDelete
The statistics published doesn't seemed to correlate with what we see on the roads or places we go.ReplyDelete
A surau is provided almost in every building be it hospital, office, condominiums etc. How can it be only 1,000 plus?
In Pandan Indah, with a population of about 300,000 and quite balanced racial distribution, we can see a big mosque and a few smaller ones but not a single buddhist, hindu temple nor a church.
As someone pointed out, a latuk kong is not a temple.
helo kawan. mosque funding comes from baitulmal, la, which is paid into by muslims only. okla, it's true that jkr co-ordinate. but baitulmal accounts get audited. recently where i stay the umno-controlled mosque want to apply to expand/rebuild the old mosque (which is memang patut buat la, to be fair). standard jkr design cost 4.5 mil, but they thot got contact la konon, want to ask for 9 mil - buat malu melayu aja, dia ingat duit tu turun dari langit ke apa. duit siapa agaknya dia ingat, yang dia mintak tu! tapi failed to get it, baitulmal won't give. like i said, if give, how can pass audit. ended up getting only 4 mil, i think. but it's better to have few and large (use fewer resources, less land, in theory brings more people together in few places - you know, that's the point of friday prayers) than have everyone build wherever they want and end up with small but thousands of locations - but maybe this makes more sense to the other faiths, depending on their philosophy on congregation and the purpose of house of worship. incidentally, this is why many suraus also get demolished. like in housing areas which before no nearby mosque so build suraus. then when there's a mosque built, ppl supposed to pergi masjidla... not the surau. defeats the purpose of the masjid as stated above (ok i know most masjid controlled by umno, but i think wrong thing cannot be corrected with another wrong thing).ReplyDelete
also i disagree hindraf never mentioned hatred of islam. in the memorandum they specifically said that the MUSLIM extremist govt is doing this and that to hindus/indians/tamil - whichever, it seems like they can't settle on one or the other - even though the govt is a coalition of malay, chinese and indian, and is themselves OPPOSED BY malays (esp. the islamic party PAS), chinese, indians etc. so, by invoking the irrelevant 'muslim' part in their memorandum to me betrays at least a desire to capitalise on worldwide anti-muslim feelings to advance their cause, and at most a hatred of muslims. it is very scary to read the threat to turn malaysia into 'a sri lanka' because everyone knows the tamil tigers do suicide bombing. desperately poor terengganu ppl cheated from their oil royalty also never threatened this. i just cannot accept even threatening violence. especially when my race is implicitly marked as the target of the violence.
that said, i also never felt suddenly suspicious of my indian colleagues, friends, guards, etc. i know that there were ppl who helped and hid other races against their own even during may 13, and my own grandpa hid a chinese man from the japanese during the world war. i'd like to think that the people i come into contact with are like these, rather than the ones who will carry bombs into my housing estate. what is the alternative? suspicion of your own neighbours? that's no alternative at all. we the people must always be determined to be friends, no matter what. govt can't do anything to split us up if we don't want to be.
malays are not immigrants except in the modern sense of the word, it's only because modern borders split up malay land into several countries, ok! there's a reason why this whole archipelago is called kepulauan melayu, and the peninsular called tanah melayu. in a larger sense, everything from sumatra to philippines is the land of rumpun melayu, which includes all ethnic melayu subtypes who settled here, including the orang asli who came first and the maritime malays who colonised the coastlands. it is just like the many old kingdoms and subraces in east asia, and the many kingdoms and subpeoples in the indian subcontinent. but they all belong there as natives, right? similarly for malays. just because our region is split up by sea doesn't mean it's not one cultural region just like indochina is one cultural region. we were a maritime people. the point is that the remembered culture and language/psyche of the people is rooted/evolved in the land, that makes a race native. maybe it received influence from elsewhere, but is always associated with this archipelago. if you learn english and read english books written by english ppl, you go to england's wild places and can feel what they write about - the mists, the moors, the overall feel of the language match the land. likewise for malay, and i suspect should be for other races too. then you have the malay subtypes. the one defined in malaysia constitution is the subtype whose culture became dominated by the ppl being muslim, i.e. the raja2 melayu type, covering our states, pattani, brunei, sumatra. other subtypes are the orang asli and borneo tribes, the christian filipinos, the other indonesian subtypes.ReplyDelete
so pls, be more sensitive and informed and don't say malays are immigrants in our own kepulauan. we can all be citizens of the modern state of malaysia, but this land is special to malays because our whole identity evolved from it - whether the maritime identity or the rainforest. the state can be built anywhere on any land, and non-native citizens consider whatever land to be about the same in relevance and love whatever land the state happens to be build on. but natives care that it be on *this* land, other land is not the same even if the entire constitution and government etc. remains the same. ppl can migrate to france or germany from india or japan or wherever, but they will not be 'native' of france or germany or wales or scotland - why you think french ppl work so hard to press for french culture to be dominant while immigrant numbers are rising? no race wants to be extinct. i think maybe chinese and indians don't understand because india and china is in no danger of not being indian and chinese, and there are billions and billions of indians and chinese all over the world propagating their cultures. but if you understand how the welsh feel, worrying about the decline of their language and the dominance of english culture and the growing immigrant cultures within their nation (i studied in wales, you see) try to transfer that to your malay countrymen and then maybe you can understand a bit (not the umno ppl though; not only terrorist but the corrupt also have no race).
incidentally this is why i think the malay language is important to save. a language carries in it the worldview and the psyche of a people which is shaped by the land they lived in while the language evolves. mastering a language (i don't mean 'language for communication') brings with it all the associated connection and emotion related to the specific worldview. the better you are at a language, the more you belong to that people/the land where the language evolved.
Count me in, in your interfaith orgies..
At least the girls do keep one common thing 'straight' for every normal men to ease their fucking-racist-shit-mind out.. women are less racist compared to men ... there is no racism in 'this underworld' for sure!
I can't live a week without the China dolls, the Malays thought good are not so to their heart at this work, so far the Indians is the best 'blower' here..The Thais & Philipines abroad are damn professionals!
..unleash the orgies to ease tension..not destruction..
Peace everybody! mmuahhh.. girls!
Phew! So all those 57 comments are by much learned malaysians. Let`s get one thing straight hinduism is not a monotheistic religion.ReplyDelete
Just saying hindu temples and then equating it to mosques/churches/gurdwaras is not right.
To start off with there are the trinity of Shiva/Vishnu/Brama and usually the devotees of one will not to to the others` temple.
Then there are Ganesha, Kali, Lakshmi etc.
I`ll let someone else do the maths on that.
Anonymouse...i'll exercise the utmost restraint here...firstly, you should change your ID to Annoying Rat based on your utterly sexist comment...secondly, if you cared to reveal your real identity and show your face, then maybe your bragging would carry some weight...otherwise we would be inclined to believe that you are just a wishful, impotent pervert jerking off to porn sites in front of your computer... judging from the cliched sexcapades of yours lah...kapische???ReplyDelete
Had only the government be a tad more sensitive in demolition the temples.... this whole thing could have been avoided. The writing has been on the wall even from last year when even foreign media started reporting on it. HINDRAF has meticulously collected all its futile attempts to plead to the powers that be.ReplyDelete
All of us Malaysians are collectively paying the price of insenstivity of each other's beliefs.
And as we speak there is a fatwa by a Mufti in Sabah on Buddha's statues.
When even UMNO, the majority party and the decision makers lacks sensitivity and they should be leading the way..but are the greatest racists of all. ...
Guys, we are in big trouble. Big time.
You can see the prejudice when they start calling UMNO and only UMNO as a racist and nationalist party. Just wonder if UMNO is really a racist party would there be chineses and indian immigrants here?ReplyDelete
Sorry if your take my remarks so much to the heart .... last time i'm a racist..now i turn into sexist..? wow!
as a so called rat..i do live in real world! Truth do hurts sometimes.
I would prefer to resort to spa & masseur houses rather on that unrealistic synthetic-cyber-porn junkies things...the last think i would like is the fucking UMNO-control city council to messed up with all these places...pretend to be holy but actually they're more filthy than shit!
Think! why such cases Nurin only happened in country like Malaysia..not Thailand & Philipines..? Fucking holy Hadhari states? what a crap!
The one who you should pissed off lady is the beast pervert out there that resorted to children like Nurin.. not someone like me..the beast is the real sexist if u ask me! (targeting all females regardless ages!)
You ultra-feminist should be united against this beast..not guy like me.. I sinfully comfort legal girls..not rape & kill children!
Not to brag so much lady but I'm a mechanical engineer, bachelor, below 30, I got my own hard earned money & wise enough brain.
Althought i maybe a rat to you but i do live with a pride of my own..
Well its not everyday i give comment here in this blog.. i got a lot of better thing to do rather than be accused as a cyber pervert by an anon 'lady?'
If you feel that you fit this bill, let me know:
Genuine female, below 30yrs,5'2"-5'8", 30"-25"-34" or equivalent specs, good looking regardless of any races, self-picture attached..i'll reveal my contact to you then..
Otherwise lady, the exchange is closed.. really sorry, forgive me mamma..i'm a bad boy!
..........end of line..............
Dear Rocky Bru's commenters,
I regret for being a racist Malay to the Indian & Chinese (..its all after hearing the story from my father last week balik kampung)..
My father's ancestor was from India, brought by British to Malaya to serve as a majistret, he married an Arab lady..my father even said the couple are very2 contrast in color (black & white?,that really explain a lot why my uncles (father's cousins) look like India muslim, my father is fair instead, probably followed his great2-grandmother genes,)Their 3rd decendent married a Chinese lady.
My mother side was from Pattani, her descendent married Malays..
I'm a 5th generation -
A hybrid Asian blood..Malay+Thai+Chinese+Indian+Arab..truly Asian..
Forgive me my fellow blogger..I should be thankful that I got the bumiputera status rather than bragging to much about it coz genetically I'm not a pure Malay breed..its all about time things only.
The Malays are all Hindus & Buddhist last time before they converted to Muslim..the Candi Lembah Bujang in Kedah proved it all..you can still see Hindu Malay in Bali nowdays!..The so-called Malay migrated from Yunan probably in Bronze Age to Tanah Melayu dominating the coast line & chased away all the Penan & Orang Asli into the jungle (penjajah!)..same like English people in today America & Australia chasing away all the natives from the coast line.
My father really give me one round hard lecture for being an unthankful racist brat..
Forgive me my Asian brothers, especially the Indian!
anonymouse a.k.a fendi